My Apology To Big Giant Circles.

[Meteo Xavier]

I very much believe people who act like assholes in public should be required to apologize with great humility in public where everyone can see it, and I was an asshole today and I figured this would be a better place for that than the topic itself.

I really am genuinely disturbed by previous OCR artists who only seem to return to the community when they need listeners or people to back their crowdfunders. I would like to see artists who use OCR as their market continue to provide music and regular posting to the community so that I feel like contributing $25-$100 to a friend, not someone who only sees me and you as dollar signs based on previous prestige. That was my intent behind my comment today.

At the same time, my comment and sentiment was largely inspired by things completely irrelevant to the subject at hand, and that was most definitely wrong. That I will apologize for. I am told my next slip-up will result in a ban, and I will accept that consequence as well.

It is now my policy to create actions in making amends for transgressions, and I feel this time I should go an extra mile and open the floor to the public reasonable requests for making amends, either to Jimmy, OCR, or I guess anyone for anything. Unfortunately all my money right now is locked down for an unrelated health-related thing coming up, but otherwise I am willing to pay other prices for this shameful behavior I have been exuding.

[Damashii!!]

1. Public, honest apologies are usually a sign of great character.

2. I'm sure everybody understands where you're coming from. It is a bit annoying when OCR vets who haven't been seen in ages just randomly show up for advertising purposes, so I don't think your head was in the wrong place; it's mostly just the way you said it, but again, Big Giant Apology sounds Big Giant nice.

2. Lastly, I'm not BGC himself so I cannot speak on his behalf, but judging by his video he seems like a genuinely awesome and understanding person so I'm sure he wasn't fuming over your comment. He was probably just thinking "well fine, no cool t-shirts for you suckaaa, ha haa haaaaa!" ;P

[Meteo Xavier]

I ain't here to defend myself, I'm here to make amends. Character, ego, words are all bullshit. What matters are actions, and if I'm that close to a ban, that means I owe the community here some real work.

[Brandon Strader]

I agreed with your original comment, that's why I quoted it. I find it offensive that reasonable dissent was met with a warning of ban. You feeling that it's wrong for people to monetize OCR is not an attack on the community, if anything it's the complete opposite.

[Liontamer]

This isn't a reply against Meteo (thanks for apologizing), but it is against that negative mentality.

If we felt Jimmy was a Big Giant Opportunist, djp and I wouldn't have recorded anything for his video, for one thing.

For another, Jimmy's contributed a lot of mixes, he's been a judge, he's given of his time and energy to help OCR keep on chugging, and he's given years of sharing his knowledge directly with artists here to help them improve. When artists like Jimmy, who have grown in part due to OCR, make it, that proves that what we're collectively doing is good. So if anyone claimed Jimmy is just USING OCR, that's just ignorant and unfair. He's given to OCR; him being able to plug his projects is cool with us.

Also, it's not to say that a past contributor could never seem tacky trying to pimp a Kickstarter, but if we saw something egregious like 3 threads per month saying gimme $, we'd step in. On the flip side, I think it's silly to have some expectation like (paraphrasing) "If they're not at least sending in a mix every year or so, then they're just whoring their Kickstarter, they're not really part of OCR anymore."

Really? Do we OWN everyone's time and energy and they have to be super directly involved with OCR forever? Of course not. So why push people away with this kind of attitude when they're successful or trying to expand their reach? What's next, Danny B's not loyal enough? Mega Ran's not loyal enough? Jillian's not loyal enough? It's OK for contributors to just pass through and move on.

And lemme just say this, let's just pretend it WAS someone else who has been long gone and had only 1 mix. If, for example, bazooie had come back around to plug his Kickstarter (which he should have) and *GASP* ask for money, then I'd say WELCOME BACK! It's a CONTRIBUTOR.

We specifically allow posted ReMixers to hawk their wares in Community, because they've given to the website. That hasn't changed just because they don't stay current or engaged in the day-to-day. It's OK to pitch this community on your stuff even if you're a not a regular artist anymore.

I'd hate to think if anyone else here drifted away but came back to plug an album release or fundraising project that others would feel they're just money-grubbers or disloyal outsiders. Just relax, it's fine. Once you get a mix posted, you're an OC ReMixer. The party will always be here. Drift in and out and your leisure, and feel free to announce yourself when you want.

EDIT: I'm not involved in any ban warnings here, and I think that's not needed, but Brandon, that attitude of snarky disgust with an OC ReMixer plugging a perfectly legal, legitimate Kickstarter is what's detrimental to the community, not Jimmy promoting his Kickstarter. No one is being coerced to hand Jimmy money, and he's not being obnoxious in his promotion. So get over it.

Edited September 25, 2013 by Liontamer

[Damashii!!]

I'd hate to think if anyone else here drifted away but came back to plug an album release or fundraising project that others would feel they're disloyal outsiders. Just relax, it's fine. Once you get a mix posted, you're an OC ReMixer. The party will always be here. Drift in and out and your leisure, and feel free to announce yourself when you want.

Thanks. I'm glad to know in advance that this community will support my endeavors as a fashion model.

aaaiight, I'm out now. I'll stop jokin around here.

[big giant circles]

Thanks Larry.

To Meteo, I feel like a public apology was actually unnecessary, but since you have taken the time to make one I will humbly accept without ire of any kind.

Brandon, I personally discussed this with Meteo outside OCR, and honestly, I don't feel like getting into it with you, because I truly do not respect you at this point. Every time I've tried to give you the benefit of the doubt, you respond with kneejerk ignorance and I have just about no desire to try and reason with you at this point.

Suffice me to say, if you feel that just because I don't often post specifically on the forums that I should not be able to post any of my own personal news or projects that are relevant to the subject of video game music and video game style music, then I heartily reject your opinion. I prefer to engage with and promote OCR on other available networks first these days. I've worked hard (as have you, Meteo, and countless other people here) to help build this community into the thriving hub of video game music and VGM enthusiasts that it is. So why on earth am I required to meet whatever criteria you've personally set before I'm allowed to share my work here without being resented/criticized by you?

And if it's about money? Sorry, you're just going to have to come to grips with the fact that some people are making money off of their music. What constitutes "monetizing OCR"? Would it be ok if I simply released my album and shared a link to it on the forums? I sure hope so, you yourself have done it.

If it's offensive to post about a kickstarter, then I guess there's loads of other OC Remixers who are in trouble then eh? Considering that preordering the album at $10 (which is what it will cost once released) is actually a better deal now b/c you get additional rewards for the same price, I'm not sure how I could be taking advantage of anyone. And considering that I've spent thousands of my own dollars on the project (and have thousands yet to spend once it's over) I can effectively say that I'm not only not ashamed to have posted it, but I'm rather touched and also invigorated by how many people seem to be passionate and supportive about the video game style music I'm trying to create.

I might seem intentionally abrasive here (and I think I've even said this before) but people like you are one reason I don't bother to post much on here lately. Your compulsion to want people to either adhere to your personal standards of what is acceptable or otherwise prove themselves worthy by the same token are both absurd and offensive to me.

Jake/Virt Kaufman said something to me a couple years ago that I will never forget. It changed my life. He said "You know, I will never ever resent anyone, friend or not, for succeeding in music. I will always be happy for them." And you know what? It's one of the best things I've ever heard to this day. Try it sometime. I think you'll find that letting go of the need to vilify people will improve the quality of your life.

[HoboKa]

Nvm, take it back, just a brief lapse of judgement yet again. Plz ignore what I had put here if you did see it ><

Edited September 25, 2013 by HoboKa

[AngelCityOutlaw]

"You know, I will never ever resent anyone, friend or not, for succeeding in music. I will always be happy for them."

That is a damn good quote.

[Brandon Strader]

I'm sorry you feel that way BGC, but you are also making some assumptions that are not accurate. I am happy for you, and I'm not jealous of your success. I think that was the worst possible conclusion you could have jumped to, but it's understandable. My criticisms have always ever come down to you not being an active part of OCR. Zircon said you're on secret projects, which is good, but there are many projects run by others that are just as deserving of your consideration. I'm not talking about FF3, it is not personal. If you feel that it is personal then you are wrong, and if I led you to believe as much, I apologize. There are a lot of other projects that are public that you could help with.

Is it so hard to be a part of OC ReMix? Saying you left because of people like me is a cop out. You were gone before I ever criticized one of your album threads, that's the whole point. I check OCR a ridiculous amount of times per day, and I post far more often than I should. I do it because I love the site and the community, and I consider myself a part of it. It's not a contest to see who can post or be here more. That's not the point. If you don't want to be around more often then that's your choice, and I will refrain from criticizing you for popping in to post album threads and then leave in the future.

It's not wrong to post album threads, or if you need help with a Kickstarter to post a thread for that. Yours sold out in 20 minutes and was 300% overfunded by the end of the day, then you still posted a thread seeking money at OCR. That's what rubbed me the wrong way. I was being obtuse and forgot the whole pledge aspect where you send out gifts to people, shortsighted on my part. But it came from what you said to me before, which I can't even quote, as it was way too long. You sent me a message called "." during the Assassin's Creed Revelations contest, where the topic of discussion was whoever won recording the AC theme with Hans Zimmer for a mere $2,000. (Madeline Bell won, several of us entered). The argument was that you thought $2,000 was far too cheap, that the contest wasn't worthwhile at that price point, Hans Zimmer could afford to pay the singer more. While I can understand your views there, it always colored you as a money guy to me not just because of your opinion, which is fine -- people have them -- but the length at which you scolded me over my wrong opinion.

Maybe it's wrong of me to think of you as a money guy. You're obviously a very good fund raiser and that comes from somewhere. Honestly, it's not my place to question your motivations. Like everyone else here, I can often make inaccurate assumptions based on stuff I should have let go in the past.

Wasn't my intention to make you mad or drive you away. Get back here.

Also Virt is a great guy and a valuable source of advice. I'm also not jealous of him and I'm glad he is as successful as he is.

[Tuberz McGee]

Hey. We're all bros right?

Everyone here should just chill and grab an ice cream.

I'll shout you all ice creams if I see y'all in person.

Ice cream makes happiness and happiness makes the world go around. <3

- Love Tuberz

xoxoxox

[Damashii!!]

Hey. We're all bros right?

Everyone here should just chill and grab an ice cream.

I'll shout you all ice creams if I see y'all in person.

Ice cream makes happiness and happiness makes the world go around. <3

- Love Tuberz

xoxoxox

real talk, ma' man... Cookies and Cream for everybody. dats some gangsta shiz right there, with dem sprinkles and fudge shells and dat cherry on top.

[Tuberz McGee]

real talk, ma' man... Cookies and Cream for everybody. dats some gangsta shiz right there, with dem sprinkles and fudge shells and dat cherry on top.

Dude.

No-one can be angry with a Cookies and Cream Ice Cream in their hand.

I've tried.

There's an equilibrium shift that makes the Cookies and Cream more delicious.

[Meteo Xavier]

To Meteo, I feel like a public apology was actually unnecessary, but since you have taken the time to make one I will humbly accept without ire of any kind.

It couldn't have been more necessary. I'm a natural troublemaker. I'm a perpetually negative person with zero charisma who brings everyone else down for irrelevant reasons. Can't even buy success but can create disaster without batting an eye. If I was smart when I started out here, I would've kept my mouth shut and just submitted tracks, but I didn't do that.

I'm aware I have a poor reputation on here and I did that being a troublemaker. I'm also aware I've played the Aspie card enough to know that the community and higher ups just barely tolerate me for that reason alone. If I didn't wear that card on my forehead, I'd be in the same room as Killer Studio Chops and Technomanga. Run out on a rail by a community that deserves better.

Instead, you publish my remixes, album and get me a listing on VGdb for free and I take it for granted and be an asshole to people anyway. No other board on the internet would put up with that shit. I wouldn't, I'd tell yonder asshole to start giving back to the community if he wants to pretend his opinions are that important in the first place.

I didn't think I'd be the first person I saw to do that, but here we are all the same.

[Feep]

Been awhile since I posted here, but this was brought to my attention by a few mutual friends.

Brandon, I'm in absolute awe of your post. You're chiding Jimmy for pursuing a professional career in music? For devoting himself to his craft, for following his passion, and working like crazy in a field that doesn't pay nearly well enough?

"Is it so hard to be a part of OC Remix?" Apparently, it is, because if you don't take out a ton of time in your busy schedule to contribute to a volunteer-based album, you get chewed out by a bunch of children. Not that Jimmy blew up a bridge when he left; he's still on great terms with a lot of the musicians here. He simply made the professional decision to use his time a bit more wisely.

Him posting here is extremely relevant; it's a fantastic album and has tons of VG musical influences. If you don't want the music, then you don't contribute. It's that simple. But chiding him for posting about it, to a lot of people with whom he still has very positive relations, is ridiculous; *he's posting about video game music on a video game music website*.

Secret projects? Well, I'm the directing head of a not-so-secret project (There Came an Echo) that Jimmy's working on, and his output has thus far been absolutely stellar. He's been a pleasure to work with, and hell, I'm not even paying him enough money to do it. He's an awesome guy, and anyone slandering him is gonna have a real tough time getting in my good graces.

I'm out. Sorry for the drama, but I just thought this was utterly insane. Jimmy's awesome.

[AngelCityOutlaw]

If I composed music for Bioware, OCRemix is probably the last place I would be hanging out on a regular basis too.

[Brandon Strader]

Brandon, I'm in absolute awe of your post. You're chiding Jimmy for pursuing a professional career in music?

No, I wasn't.

If I composed music for Bioware, OCRemix is probably the last place I would be hanging out on a regular basis too.

I'd still come to OCR. But having read Larry's post I guess it's not a big deal.

[DarkeSword]

Jimmy's not just a posted remixer either. He was a prominent staff member who contributed heavily to the site and the panel when he "worked" here. I know OCR gets accused of a lot of cliqueishness, which is something we generally just laugh at because it's so ridiculous, but as far as I'm concerned, if you're a former staff member of OCR who's contributed as much as Jimmy did, you can post about whatever projects you're working on and ask for as much cash as you want, regardless of whether you're visibly active or not.

Also just as an aside, djpretzel, Larry, Nutrious, and I all hung out with Jimmy at PAX (Serious Pie!!!) and you've got to be kidding yourself if you think he just used us a stepping stone. He was there at our panel supporting us and he and DannyB both gave the site a great shout out at the 30 Years of VGM panel. He's definitely OCR-for-life.

It honestly boggles my mind when OCR has to defend its staff and former staff against accusations of taking advantage of the community. Give me a break.

[Damashii!!]

Jaizus Christ, ladies and gents...

please take the rustled jimmies to the pm's or Facebook or something. c'mon dawg... I said this in another thread, I've been digging OCR for a long time but I've only started lurking a bunch a few years ago and then actively participating recently, so I'm not aware of all the weird stuff that happened between him and her and them and whoever else from the past.

but that's it.

the past.

Let it be, chill with Tuberz and I, and grab some ice cream and just go on. Relevant Points have been made, and the party's over. Out! Out!

Dramarama extravaganza 2013 is done!

don't make me start posting silly pics up this biznitch. I mean it.

[he said she said /thread]

EDIT: I'm all for public apologies and making amends but I think the deals been sealed, the cake's been cut, the fat lady has sung, the cow jumped over the moon, etc.

Edited September 25, 2013 by Damashii!!

[Liontamer]

If I composed music for Bioware, OCRemix is probably the last place I would be hanging out on a regular basis too.

Hey, you shutupz!

I'd still come to OCR. But having read Larry's post I guess it's not a big deal.

You're ruining it for those of us still on staff who dream of one day escaping.

[HoboKa]

Hey. We're all bros right?

Everyone here should just chill and grab an ice cream.

I'll shout you all ice creams if I see y'all in person.

Ice cream makes happiness and happiness makes the world go around. <3

- Love Tuberz

xoxoxox

I could go for some of that about now. OCR can be so sour sometimes; needs some more sweetness

real talk, ma' man... Cookies and Cream for everybody. dats some gangsta shiz right there, with dem sprinkles and fudge shells and dat cherry on top.

Yayy sprinkles!

I know OCR gets accused of a lot of cliqueishness, which is something we generally just laugh at because it's so ridiculous

Always gonna be some clique, can't be avoided with a bunch of pretentious nerds like me, Brandon, Meteo and sometimes the jdfgts >:3

EDIT

Yeah I know DS was mainly referring to ppl accusing the staffers of being cliquey, but the people who aren't staffers also affect how OCR can be perceived by others. I probably shouldn't have pulled any names out though. So hopefully no one took too much offence =/

(not that any1 cares to listen to me q.q /wrists)

Edited September 25, 2013 by HoboKa

[Brandon Strader]

You're ruining it for those of us still on staff who dream of one day escaping.

I know you are joking because you put the . I think a lot of my bitterness stems from the fact that I really value OCR to the point that I'm probably a little over-protective of it. That probably sounds ridicuous to you but it's the best way I can think of to explain how I feel. I'm getting old, by this point in my life I should have accomplished so much more but I don't regret my time at OCR. It saddens me that my community contribution is seen (not by all but by some) as a detriment. I think I have improved and I am open to more things than I ever would have considered in the past (you once called me a wet blanket). OCR and my contribution to both the site and the community is really important to me because it's the only really meaningful thing I have been able to accomplish in my life up to this point. The only times I've considered leaving OCR is when others have made me feel that I need to or that I am damaging the site by being here. That's the opposite of what I set out to do. I hold no ill will towards Jimmy or what he put into the site nor am I bitter or jealous that he is famous or successful. I JUST would like to see him around here more. That's ALL there is to it. And others have told me I am wrong. Look, he's free to do what he wants. I'm not going to gripe about it anymore. If it was me, I'd still be here. I can understand if he's too busy to come here but I don't think that's really the case, and his assertion that he doesn't come here because of me or 'people like me' hurts.

I am poo and I'm stupid, I get it.. I'll just leave it at that, and give apologies for rustling Jimmy.

[Meteo Xavier]

Let it be, chill with Tuberz and I, and grab some ice cream and just go on. Relevant Points have been made, and the party's over. Out! Out!

Dramarama extravaganza 2013 is done!

Well, the OTHER reason I'm asking is because it makes a difference if I try to lock myself out of this account again or not. Suffice to say, I rarely get more dignified options than self-destruction on a lot of occasions.

[big giant circles]

Where do I even start?

I'm sorry you feel that way BGC, but you are also making some assumptions that are not accurate. I am happy for you

Your posts implied otherwise.

and I'm not jealous of your success. I think that was the worst possible conclusion you could have jumped to, but it's understandable. My criticisms have always ever come down to you not being an active part of OCR.

Once again, you're setting the criteria that I'm apparently supposed to adhere to. I think what you mean by active is "someone who posts constantly on the forums and is doing lots of album projects". I could be mistaken, but your posts suggest otherwise.

Zircon said you're on secret projects, which is good, but there are many projects run by others that are just as deserving of your consideration. I'm not talking about FF3, it is not personal. If you feel that it is personal then you are wrong, and if I led you to believe as much, I apologize. There are a lot of other projects that are public that you could help with.

Brandon, there may be a more sugar-coated way to say this, but who are you to tell me how to spend my time? If I seem indignant of this it's because I absolutely am. You have no place to tell me how I should have to divide my attentions during the day to have any kind of valid voice in this community. I could unload on you for days on this specifically, but I've already made my point there, so I'll leave it at that.

Is it so hard to be a part of OC ReMix?

Again, I think you mean to say "Is it hard to post constantly on the forums and contribute to a half a dozen or more remix project"? And to that I say, it's irrelevant, and I fail to see how that matters. Life happens, people grow in and out of things, peoples interests evolve and change, and there are only so many hours in the day I have to split among too many things. I've chosen to lurk on the forums rather than actively participate in them. I also interact with OCR on other social outlets. I also gave the site some $10,000+ in download codes for the FF6 campaign. I also gave three years as a judge, created and spearheaded something like 4 separate "April is Support OCR Month" campaigns for something like $12,000+ in donations to the site, and CONSTANTLY pimp OCR in various interviews/podcasts/articles/video game functions I've participated in in the past few years. I'm sorry my level of participation isn't up to your code.

Saying you left because of people like me is a cop out. You were gone before I ever criticized one of your album threads, that's the whole point. I check OCR a ridiculous amount of times per day, and I post far more often than I should. I do it because I love the site and the community, and I consider myself a part of it. It's not a contest to see who can post or be here more. That's not the point.

I feel like you're trying to say "It doesn't matter how often you post here" while in the same breath saying "look at ME and how much *I* post here because I love OCR more than you do!". That's the gist I'm getting, whether or not it's your intent.

If you don't want to be around more often then that's your choice, and I will refrain from criticizing you for popping in to post album threads and then leave in the future.

And yet... here we are. Again.

It's not wrong to post album threads, or if you need help with a Kickstarter to post a thread for that. Yours sold out in 20 minutes and was 300% overfunded by the end of the day, then you still posted a thread seeking money at OCR. That's what rubbed me the wrong way.

So I should have only shared my project until it was funded? Should Dave have pulled FF6 once it hit 30k? "The goal was reached gang, let's bring it in, gg, no need for extra funding that will enable awesome additional perks." Come on dude. I mean this legit. If you ever launch a kickstarter and it gets 5000% overfunded, I will be happy for you. I won't question who you chose to tell about it or how you market yourself (as long as it's not invasive or spammy). Golden rule and all that. Try it out. And for what it's worth, if I made exactly $5000 on my campaign, I would actually still be in the red. I asked for a low figure because I was genuinely worried that there wouldn't be enough demand for what I'm offering. And even at 300+% overfunding, I'm sitting on a smaller pile of money than it appears. Not to mention, for a project that's taken 2+ years to make, I'd actually make more money (and enjoy benefits) working at Walmart. So let's not be too quick to judge things like that, shall we?

I was being obtuse and forgot the whole pledge aspect where you send out gifts to people, shortsighted on my part.

We agree on that

But it came from what you said to me before, which I can't even quote, as it was way too long. You sent me a message called "." during the Assassin's Creed Revelations contest, where the topic of discussion was whoever won recording the AC theme with Hans Zimmer for a mere $2,000. (Madeline Bell won, several of us entered). The argument was that you thought $2,000 was far too cheap, that the contest wasn't worthwhile at that price point, Hans Zimmer could afford to pay the singer more. While I can understand your views there, it always colored you as a money guy to me not just because of your opinion, which is fine -- people have them -- but the length at which you scolded me over my wrong opinion.

Part of why I don't participate often in the forums right there, as mentioned. Responding to things like this is very time consuming and rarely lightens my mood. And maybe I shouldn't do it, but after the whatever-th time you keep singling out my personal projects that I share, I feel compelled to tell you why you're getting under my skin every time. At any rate, another reason I rarely participate is that since making the (rather difficult despite what anyone might think) transition to writing music professionally for a living, I feel like there's a natural conflict of interest of sorts between me and some of this community. It's unsettling to me. All the time I was a hobbyist remixer I dreamed of one day writing music for actual games. And now I'm lucky enough to be doing it occasionally. It is NOT a field that has given me riches, I can promise you that. But it does pay my bills and I'm happy so far. I'm disappointed that there seem to be people (like you) who would rather be resentful that I've moved on to the next level of writing music, rather than excited by it. I'm not asking you (or anyone) for personal congratulations, I'm just saying I find it kind of sad that I'm now an outcast who just stops by to "monetize" you guys like some heartless corporate robot.

Maybe it's wrong of me to think of you as a money guy. You're obviously a very good fund raiser and that comes from somewhere. Honestly, it's not my place to question your motivations.

Then don't. Or at least, do it respectfully.

Like everyone else here, I can often make inaccurate assumptions based on stuff I should have let go in the past.

Wasn't my intention to make you mad or drive you away. Get back here.

I AM back here. I never left. Unless you mean post every day and sign up for all the projects that I just don't have the time for because I need to ya know, pay my bills and eat food. In which case, I will probably not be doing.

Also Virt is a great guy and a valuable source of advice. I'm also not jealous of him and I'm glad he is as successful as he is.

I think you missed my point. I (possibly incorrectly) assumed you're annoyed with me because I seem to be making money off my music, and I was simply saying that learning to take a congratulatory perspective instead of a cynical one will do wonders for your mood and overall likability.

*EDIT*

In the time it took me to respond, a zillion other people have responded first. Oh well. Maybe some of this has been addressed already. I'll let it stand.

[big giant circles]

Jaizus Christ, ladies and gents...

please take the rustled jimmies to the pm's or Facebook or something. c'mon dawg... I said this in another thread, I've been digging OCR for a long time but I've only started lurking a bunch a few years ago and then actively participating recently, so I'm not aware of all the weird stuff that happened between him and her and them and whoever else from the past.

but that's it.

the past.

Let it be, chill with Tuberz and I, and grab some ice cream and just go on. Relevant Points have been made, and the party's over. Out! Out!

Dramarama extravaganza 2013 is done!

don't make me start posting silly pics up this biznitch. I mean it.

[he said she said /thread]

EDIT: I'm all for public apologies and making amends but I think the deals been sealed, the cake's been cut, the fat lady has sung, the cow jumped over the moon, etc.

I actually am sorry this is a public thing. Strader brings out the worst in me somehow

You're right though. I think the post before this will be my last in this thread. I can't imagine a lot more good coming from this. The initial apology was fully accepted, feel free to lock it up whenever you like