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so, i got an email about FL12 today. i've not used FL Studio since 10 (due to indolence, not due to switching DAWs). is this a worthy upgrade? i know there's some real citrusheads here so i'm hoping i can get a quick overview of what's changed practically from 11 to 12.

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i'll probably be in trouble because with the grand redesign and everything, you likely won't be able to reactivate the old pattern blocks with a reg edit. i'm one of the few users who still prefers them. idk, i think the "new" patterns introduced a couple unnecessary clicks.

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I can't for the life of me figure out how to add something as simple as plain old sample and audio clip channels in FL12. If they got rid of such fundamental functionality, I think I'll just stick with FL11.

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I think I'll just stick with FL11.

i'm likely in that boat as well, see you there :D

which is a shame as the GUI changes seem very neat.

or wait, i could become a powa usa and bully them until they include the ancient blocks in FL12.....

ZIRCON FIX PLZ KTHX

Edited by Nase

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I was thinking to check it out considering I already been playing with the of shifting to another DAW. after about 9 years of handling Fruity Loops.

But then again i did purchase the signature edition might be a good idea to get those moneys worth at least 10 years yet. glad to see they are still improving there software. Love the touch features they incorporated.

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Just popping in to say I'm in the FL10 boat too due to pattern blocks.

The ones you use in the playlist? They're still there in FL 11. :)

(the only thing I did was merge some FL 10 graphics with FL 11, but that's because I don't like the FL 11 VST channel fonts. :-P)

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I can't for the life of me figure out how to add something as simple as plain old sample and audio clip channels in FL12. If they got rid of such fundamental functionality, I think I'll just stick with FL11.

It hasn't changed in FL12. :/

Brad, to answer your question (which hasn't really happened in the thread yet), here:

-All GUI elements are vectorial and can scale. This is just visual and helpful for multi-monitors or whatever. You can also set animation complexity.

-New mixer, this is big. You can now select more than one mixer track at the same time, and naturally they built some features around it, like highlighting a group of tracks and sending them to a bus, or just riding multiple faders at once. They've also made stereo separation, left/right swap, and polarity reversal built in controls to the strip instead of on the side.

-they got rid of the archaic pattern blocks

-The plug-in architecture has now completely switched over to their new database system. This is good and bad. Good because you can categorize your VST's and whatnot and better organize the plugin lists in the "add" menus for effects or channels. It's bad because you have to now manually add all of your plug-ins to the database (or open the list of installed plugins in the FL side browser and drag from there).

-All the GUI art has been updated and modernized and this includes all of the stock FL Plugins like Peak Controller and 3xOsc. Everything just looks nicer and less 2002. I especially like the new knobs.

-There's a new FL Studio ASIO driver now. I don't think either of us are interested, but for those who are, it may be a good alternative to ASIO4ALL.

-VST Plugins deep scan is actually legitimate now, and it works, albeit it'll exhaustively scan the plug-ins for manufacturer information, plug-in type, etc. I don't use it, but it's neat.

-They've made some small mistakes, like the annoying default zoom in the piano roll and hiding the layer tool in the bowels of the software.

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to be honest, the vector change is huge for me - i'm on a 2560x1440 monitor stretched to a 1050x1680 as well, and the ui in FL10 looks like it should be on a flip phone.

it sounds like most of the changes are big positives for how i use the program, actually. i'll need to check it out. it's the first time i'll be booting up FL without having an audio interface in ten years, so that'll be new, but i'll get over it =P

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to be honest, the vector change is huge for me - i'm on a 2560x1440 monitor stretched to a 1050x1680 as well, and the ui in FL10 looks like it should be on a flip phone.

it sounds like most of the changes are big positives for how i use the program, actually. i'll need to check it out. it's the first time i'll be booting up FL without having an audio interface in ten years, so that'll be new, but i'll get over it =P

Yes, the program has largely improved. The drawbacks of some changes are only detrimental to people who don't adapt (like pattern blocks). The drawbacks of others are actually just really freaking annoying (like hiding the Layer channel in menus, seriously?)

The plug-in database is also a source of complaint, since you can't just add VST's by going in and clicking a checkbox, but I think the mental approach to it by users is a little flawed. It's more of a set-up thing now, just like making templates. You spend an hour or two adding VST's to the database and then you're set from then on; it doesn't need to be quick and on-the-fly if you treat it as an installation procedure.

Edited by Neblix

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Is the slide function still only usable in FL Studio's native plugins? Because if it is, I'll pass on upgrading for now. Still this long and they hadn't giving that function to all sounds is just asinine. :P

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Is the slide function still only usable in FL Studio's native plugins? Because if it is, I'll pass on upgrading for now. Still this long and they hadn't giving that function to all sounds is just asinine. :P

I completely agree. There are so many times I could have used the slide but couldn't because of this.

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I completely agree. There are so many times I could have used the slide but couldn't because of this.

You could accomplish a similar effect from just pitch bending the VST. Or, you could use a long glide/portamento time on overlapped notes in legato mode. There are ways around it.

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Is the slide function still only usable in FL Studio's native plugins? Because if it is, I'll pass on upgrading for now. Still this long and they hadn't giving that function to all sounds is just asinine. :P

this is something that requires effort from the vst developers, apparently. i saw that question posed at gol ages ago.

i think you're viewing it incorrectly, it's more like a trick that IL 'taught' their plugins to do, and others would have to do the same to theirs to make it all work. think about it, normally you just have this pitch value of 0-127. now you want your plugins to recalibrate the pitch based on note events. i don't think it's a simple fix on IL's side, or they would've indeed done it by now.

...or maybe they're lazy and are lying, i wouldn't notice because i know little about programming. but it makes some sense.

i think the most effective thing for everyone would be if other HOST developers decided that it's a very cool feature, swallowed their pride and stole it, while turning it into some kind of standardized thing.

bitwig atleast did something that allows you to pitchbend single notes independently, which is one of the advantages when you're using slide notes with different midi channels (the different note colors). if the vsti responds to the 16 midi channels, you can do 16 independently pitch-bent voices.

in effect, you got like a very complex polyphonic glide function. i think it's just a thing where IL is ahead of its time. we need a standard for it.

Edited by Nase

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... and I can't figure out how to add other VSTs (TAL-Noisemaker, Crystal, etc) to the DAW. As someone mentioned earlier, you can no longer just check a box and add the VST. How exactly do I go about integrating it into the new FL? Do I have to do a deep scan? I'm a noob at FL still haha so any help would be appreciated :) I'm also loving the 4 new VSTs/Effects that were added for the signature bundle. I'm going to enjoy playing with these new 'toys' :P

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...or maybe they're lazy and are lying, i wouldn't notice because i know little about programming. but it makes some sense.
Is the slide function still only usable in FL Studio's native plugins? Because if it is, I'll pass on upgrading for now. Still this long and they hadn't giving that function to all sounds is just asinine. :P

The way it works is that FL has to send MIDI data to the VST in order for the VST to understand what FL wants it to do.

This, of course, means that ad hoc stuff like FL's pitch bend notes can't ever be sent to VST's no matter how many fits you throw. It's not supported in the MIDI standard. You'll sooner see us migrate off the MIDI standard than seeing Gol come up with a way to develop an AI to sit inside FL that will decompile a VST, destruct its pitch system, and integrate FL's into it.

In the meantime, though, you can use the pitch wheel, which is already in the MIDI standard. :P

... and I can't figure out how to add other VSTs (TAL-Noisemaker, Crystal, etc) to the DAW. As someone mentioned earlier, you can no longer just check a box and add the VST. How exactly do I go about integrating it into the new FL? Do I have to do a deep scan? I'm a noob at FL still haha so any help would be appreciated :) I'm also loving the 4 new VSTs/Effects that were added for the signature bundle. I'm going to enjoy playing with these new 'toys' :P

FL%20plugins.png

Click on that icon to change the browser to plug-in browsing. If you've done your list refresh (in Options -> File Settings), click on Installed. Keep in mind that if you didn't do a deep scan, you will identically see the same plug-ins in "effects" and "generators" (it doesn't know which is which). You can drag and drop plug-ins from this list to the step sequencer and mixer. When you have a plug in open, click on the upper left menu (the arrow which sits right next to the gear icon at the top of the window) and hit "add to plugin database". It'll prompt you to pick a category, and if you look back at the browser, it now shows you those categories. Click on the folder of the category you want, and hit the "add to plugin database" thing again. (You only have to do it once if you go choose a category first, but it's an easy way to bring up the list via it prompting you)

FL%20plugins%202.png

Now, *this is important*. When adding effects you must do it *from the effects folder*. When adding generators, you must do it *from the generator folder*. If you don't FL will throw a fit, and if not crash, just say "fuck you" and make you unload the broken plug-in.

Finally, if this made no sense to you, I urge you to hit the F1 key, as that's always very helpful. Or watch:

Edited by Neblix

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coming to think of it, the right click>add new plugin routine has always felt pretty awkward. it made no sense that you had to click on another unrelated plugin to load a new one. you get used to it quickly, but it never was an ideal design.

same with the poor categorization options (nonexistent?). part of why i'm so anal about minimizing my vst number in FL is just the fact that i find long lists cumbersome to work with. a switch to folders has been overdue.

the pattern blocks, i just like them better. idk, maybe skryp can elaborate. i'd have to work on actually making a list of arguments for WHY i like em better. it's not just laziness on my part, i think.

Edited by Nase

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coming to think of it, the right click>add new plugin routine has always felt pretty awkward. it made no sense that you had to click on another unrelated plugin to load a new one. you get used to it quickly, but it never was an ideal design.

same with the poor categorization options (nonexistent?). part of why i'm so anal about minimizing my vst number in FL is just the fact that i find long lists cumbersome to work with. a switch to folders has been overdue.

Agreed. :D

the pattern blocks, i just like them better. idk, maybe skryp can elaborate. i'd have to work on actually making a list of arguments for WHY i like em better. it's not just laziness on my part, i think.

You like them because they're familiar and you're already used to them, while the drawbacks of the new system are exaggerated for you because you're not used to it yet.

Any "couple clicks" will seem like the end of the world until it becomes normal for you. I mean, there are people who use the Pro Tools piano roll, yeah?

Or in FL's case, you realize that those couple clicks offer way more functionality than pattern blocks ever did (that's why they switched). Pattern blocks are really inflexible and slowdown workflow. You can cut clips, resize them, make unique, but still organize according to your own track tastes. Pattern blocks are static size, they split into new patterns when you cut them (that's actually *really* annoying, if I want to use the last bar of a drumloop, don't split my 4 bar drum loop into a 3 and 1), you can't see what's in them on the arrangement timeline, and you're at the mercy of the pattern number tracks instead of organizing it yourself according to instrument tracks or whatever (DIY organization is the staple philosophy of FL Studio).

I actually would like them to discard the pattern system entirely, or at least make it optional; Studio One 2 and a couple other DAW's offer ghost notes for the entire project (rather than FL, which does it in patterns only), and you can freely enable and disable certain instruments in the checklist. This allows you to edit basically all your tracks in just one piano roll (just like multiple channels in FL patterns), but when you come out to the arrangement timeline, everything is properly split up into its own track (instead of one congealed blob of MIDI data). This means you can see how the parts interact in the piano roll, while still seeing the overarching make-up and progress of the track.

I do like Make Unique, and use it often, but honestly, it's not necessary. If you want to repeat something, just copy and paste it. If you want to repeat something with a variation, just copy and paste it, then edit it (no need to make unique). Sure, ctrl+c and ctrl+v is technically more strokes than painting several instances of the pattern by holding down the paint tool, but the functionality and ease of use elsewhere is much greater and outweighs it.

If you want this one thing (like a 4 bar drumloop) to be the same everywhere and to change everywhere when you edit it in just one of its instances, there are ways to do that in programming as well. Studio One has something similar. In other words, we can retain the advantages of the pattern system (easy repetition, editing multiple channels together) while getting rid of it (and thus eliminating the dumb "blocky" arrangement habits it pushes you into).

Edited by Neblix

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I do like Make Unique, and use it often, but honestly, it's not necessary. If you want to repeat something, just copy and paste it. If you want to repeat something with a variation, just copy and paste it, then edit it (no need to make unique). Sure, ctrl+c and ctrl+v is technically more strokes than painting several instances of the pattern by holding down the paint tool, but the functionality and ease of use elsewhere is much greater and outweighs it.

Well, there's one great advantage to Make Unique; it retains the event edits you do, and you don't have to re-record them, just modify them (unless you want to re-record). I use Make Unique pretty often, and I find it keeps my workflow going.

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