AngelCityOutlaw Posted May 31, 2015 Share Posted May 31, 2015 Though there is a lot of room for interpretation here, I feel like most of the labels people keep placing on this movie stem mostly from the absences of any concrete story line, Drive vehicle from A to B avoiding antagonists(...hmmm...that about sums of much of what makes the Mad Max franchise good) not to say it's poorly written, just the room for interpretation is usually the hallmark of good art. Maybe it's a retelling of the Vietnam War? Maybe I saw a critique on the War on Terror? Placing a label of Feminist simply because it had a female protagonist and some strong female leads, seems myopic. Bad guys always seem to be stealing women and (metaphorically) tying them to railroad tracks this is nothing new to storytelling, but having a female lead who isn't fawning over someone else or waiting to be recused is a more uncommon female protagonist. It's good to feel some vindication on that one... Well, as stated earlier in the thread, it's more a feminist film because what little plot there is focuses on rising against the patriarchal society. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pipez Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 The guy with the guitar fits the whole villainous excess theme the movie has going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pipez Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 Also, Max does get a bit of character development and his arc is connected with Furiosa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophetik music Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 my opinion is that this movie is a pinnacle of the action movie genre, on the level of matrix when it came out - a game-changing experience that completely redefines the expectations for competitors. also, from popehat: "So, yes, there is a bit of feminism shoe-horned awkwardly into the movie. But it's more silly than objectionable. And, in fact, conservatives will find a lot to chuckle over: the maguffin on the entire chase is the group of young breedable women…and yet not once does anyone suggest that they do anything other than breed. No, a just society, it seems, will still have these women cranking out babies…just under (heh) the good guys, and not the Ugly Old Coot.Yes, but is Fury Road a feminist movie? No. Not unless "blowing immense quantities of shit up in a vast barren desert" is a new form of feminism I'm unfamiliar with (and if it is, I promise to give feminism another look-see – that'd be a promising development). To the degree it's got any ideology, it's about ethics in truck driving: "people should not be slaves, nor should they live under corrupt all-powerful kleptocratic dictatorships". That strikes me as pretty damned libertarian." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djpretzel Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 my opinion is that this movie is a pinnacle of the action movie genre, on the level of matrix when it came out - a game-changing experience that completely redefines the expectations for competitors. also, from popehat: "So, yes, there is a bit of feminism shoe-horned awkwardly into the movie. But it's more silly than objectionable. And, in fact, conservatives will find a lot to chuckle over: the maguffin on the entire chase is the group of young breedable women…and yet not once does anyone suggest that they do anything other than breed." Already covered why I think that's off-base; doesn't add anything new to what I've already said. Also, no one suggests that they continue breeding, either - it's simply not addressed. They may want to, they may not, but either way, they want control of their reproductive rights. That doesn't seem "silly" to me, and the criticism of the omission of anyone suggesting they do "anything other than breed" seems more worthy of chuckles... where would such dialog have fit in? It would have seemed bizarre... for someone who talks about things being "shoe-horned awkwardly", he's criticizing the film for NOT having dialog that would have been exponentially MORE awkward and considerably MORE horned into a much tinier and thus MORE uncomfortable shoe!! e.g. "There's MORE to life than just breeding... you can be anything you want!" "Uhhh... it's a post-apocalytpic wasteland. No I can't." "Live your dream! Don't just breed... contribute to society!!" "Well... I hear there's an open position for the greater-area distribution manager of aquacola..." "You go, girl!!" Just sayin'... that's some pretty shoddy criticism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleck Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 the phrase "there's some feminism shoehorned in there" leads me to believe that the writer doesn't know what feminism is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoshiBlade Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 To the degree it's got any ideology, it's about ethics in truck driving: "people should not be slaves, nor should they live under corrupt all-powerful kleptocratic dictatorships". That strikes me as pretty damned libertarian. Oh boy...I feel like a "search Ron Paul" plug is just a few posts away... Seriously thought why do we have to pigeonholed a movie as Feminists? It seems to me this movie takes a different approach to what we've come to expect from a general male dominated film industry. Was Alien a feminist film? Not in my view, but it addressed the idea of masculinity and had some very strong subtext about rape that conveyed a visceral message about sexual assault that some males couldn't understand explicitly, so it was done ( very effectively) implicitly, tapping in to a more subconscious reaction. So maybe this movie isn't feminist, but conveys some ideas that a male might not see in the same way as a female? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelCityOutlaw Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Am I the only one who watches movies not giving two shits if it's feminist or not and actually just wants to see a good movie? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djpretzel Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Seriously thought why do we have to pigeonholed a movie as Feminists? It seems to me this movie takes a different approach to what we've come to expect from a general male dominated film industry. I think you're confusing "pigeonholing" a film with simply analyzing a film. The genre of the film is clearly action. You don't have to analyze it to enjoy it, but some of us enjoy the analysis, can't turn that part of our brains off (and/or don't want to), and can simultaneously enjoy the more accessible & entertaining aspects while still, you know... giving it some thought. Am I the only one who watches movies not giving two shits if it's feminist or not and actually just wants to see a good movie? Again, there's a difference between not giving "two shits if it's feminist or not" and just, you know, thinking about it... this isn't a zero-sum proposition. You can want to see a good movie AND care about interpreting it a bit. If you don't want to think about it and don't like it when others think about it, perhaps a discussion topic dedicated to talking about it isn't the place to be? I can assure you, you're NOT the only one who prefers not to analyze their entertainment critically, but I'm not sure if that's company you want to brag about keeping... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoshiBlade Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 "pigeonholing" No, no you misunderstood me, I really think everyone should see this movie while holding a pigeon, it really adds to the action and provides a unique experience, a pigeon-holdinging experience... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophetik music Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 djp, i think you'll make your point better if you use more bold and italics, just sayin AngelCityOutlaw 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleck Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Am I the only one who watches movies not giving two shits if it's feminist or not and actually just wants to see a good movie? no, you're not the only sexist, unfortunately Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelCityOutlaw Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 no, you're not the only sexist, unfortunately Oh stfu you self-righteous piece of shit. I don't care if a movie is "feminist" or not, just because I choose not to analyze everything I see politically doesn't make me a "sexist". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophetik music Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 no, you're not the only sexist, unfortunately hahaha, the salt is real. what's wrong with watching a movie and not caring about the agendas that may or may not lie behind the movie? mad max was good. it was fun to watch. the action was entertaining, the show-don't-tell style was breathtakingly fun to experience, and the characters weren't cookie-cutter characters. i didn't go to see it because of the triumph of women over oppressive male entities or something, i went to see it because they had a flamethrower guitar and the movie's a freaking two-hour car chase combined with dune and borderlands, and that sounded awesome. did it have feminist underpinnings? maybe, a lot of the arguments both for and against are pretty solid. that said, who cares? i don't, and saying that i don't have a ball in that court doesn't make me sexist any more than not really caring about r&b makes me a racist. just pointing a finger and spouting hot-button words doesn't make you look educated and relevant. it makes you look ignorant and puerile. the endless need to ascribe a crusade to everything is abhorrent. edit: the fact that an action film with a script the size of a child's flipbook is raising this many questions about the intentions of the writer(s) is actually pretty cool. as i said, i don't really have a ball in this particular court, but the noise that's being raised (on both sides of the issue/question/whatever) is definitely interesting. timaeus222 and AngelCityOutlaw 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleck Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 what's wrong with watching a movie and not caring about the agendas that may or may not lie behind the movie? there's nothing wrong with choosing not to analyze a movie; there is something wrong with trying to make other people stop because people are supposedly analyzing things too much if you don't know and/or care whether or not a movie successfully challenged problematic gender structures, that's fine - if you expect everyone else to stop talking about it as a result, shhh, the adults are talking who cares? i don't, and saying that i don't have a ball in that court doesn't make me sexist any more than not really caring about r&b makes me a racist. just pointing a finger and spouting hot-button words doesn't make you look educated and relevant. it makes you look ignorant and puerile. not getting involved in matters related to feminism doesn't make you a sexist; trying, in however manner, to stop other people from getting involved is sexist if you think the movie was feminist, talk about why if you think the movie wasn't feminist, talk about why if you don't care about whether or not the movie was sexist, don't talk about it? ? ? the only reason you would communicate to others that you don't care about something is to imply that they should also not care, and if you're saying that sexism doesn't matter, it's probably because ~you're a sexist~ Oh stfu you self-righteous piece of shit. lel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djpretzel Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 In fairness to Bleck, there's been a conversational vein of "OMFG WHY CAN'T I JUST ENJOY DA MOVIE!?!?!?!" You can. No one has said you can't, or even that you shouldn't. I certainly enjoyed it. Twice. I personally didn't find my enjoyment dampened by taking a minute or two to think about what I saw... It's a discussion topic. For discussion, see... If you want to argue that the symbolism & themes aren't there, or that they are being misinterpreted, go for it. If you want to make a blanket statement that no films should ever be analyzed, ever, you can do that as well. However, it's a little obnoxious to be all frustrated & exasperated and act borderline persecuted just because someone else disagrees and/or actually wants to discuss the film. On a discussion thread. For the film. Eh? If not here, where? Or was this supposed to just be a ROCKS! vs. SUCKS! poll of single-sentence superlatives? Amayirot Akago and Hayeser 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophetik music Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 oh, i thought it was going to be the gold vs garbage debate i'll point out, though, that expressing my exasperation about the over-politicization (is that a word?) of mad max at work got a pretty harsh backlash of "well you must be a misogynist then", which i thought was comical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleck Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 probably because the only time people ever seem to come out frustrated against analyzing a piece of media is when it happens to have to do with feminism Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelCityOutlaw Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 probably because the only time people ever seem to come out frustrated against analyzing a piece of media is when it happens to have to do with feminism Who is "frustrated" exactly? You reason that someone is a sexist who wants to stop conversation about feminism because they simply asked if no one else really cared about the feminist themes and wants to discuss other aspects of the film. That's somewhere between hilarious and pathetic. You're not nearly as intelligent as you try to pass yourself off as being and are well deserving of the "troll" label so often given to you on these forums. I presented some things I didn't like about the movie earlier in the thread, instead of anyone countering those points, the best I get is a typical douchebag one-liner from you and we're back to talking what a bag of seeds symbolizes and whether or not a guitar is supposed to be a penis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esperado Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 The fact that this movie has people so fired up in so many directions says it's a good movie in my opinion. Whether intentional or not, the movie has people thinking deeper into things, which is unusual for an action flick. Also does anyone know the backstory of the facial chroming ? djpretzel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelCityOutlaw Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 The fact that this movie has people so fired up in so many directions says it's a good movie in my opinion. Whether intentional or not, the movie has people thinking deeper into things, which is unusual for an action flick. Also does anyone know the backstory of the facial chroming ? Quote from George Miller “I saw a documentary where young [Cambodian] soldiers would go into war, they had little jaded deities — and before they ran into battle, they put them in their mouths and just held them with little straps.” also, from the same article The silver spray also seems to be a nod told the real life dangerous act of “chroming,” or huffing. The silver paint symbolizes the cars, gas and chemicals that the characters’ culture idolizes, but it also may get them high so they’re more or less OK with putting themselves in dangerous situations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoshiBlade Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 The fact that this movie has people so fired up in so many directions says it's a good movie in my opinion. Whether intentional or not, the movie has people thinking deeper into things, which is unusual for an action flick. Also does anyone know the backstory of the facial chroming ? Well it's probably just another sort of body modification or war paint...I know that some armed non state actors will give their foot soldiers drugs to fire them up...Khat was given to Somali soldiers during the Battle of Mogadishu to compensate for the lack of training and there have been reports of suicide attackers using drugs to suppress fear and increase aggression. I thought they were using the chemicals to huff, ala Jet from Fallout Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleck Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 I presented some things I didn't like about the movie earlier in the thread, instead of anyone countering those points, the best I get is a typical douchebag one-liner from you alright well 1) You'd think I'd find a balls-to-the-wall, completely over the top action film fun, and usually I do, but this time it bored me. Because most of the same faceless enemies being thrown at the protagonists and getting killed in basically the same way again and again. You can only watch people throw exploding spears at spike cars so many times before it loses its effect. saying "I was bored" isn't a valuable critique and as such nothing valuable can be gained from responding to it 2) This film has some of the most one-dimensional characters I've seen in an action film in forever. Tom Hardy also has the presence of an old, country-road mailbox. It's there, but the only reason you even care about its existence is because sometimes, the plot demands you go get the mail. You really don't care if some dumb kids shoot it hell with a .22 as long as it's empty, though and it's usually pretty empty. Max could've been completely written out of this film in 20 minutes and it would make no difference at all. literally none of the characters are one-dimensional - either you don't actually know what that term means, or you weren't paying attention 3) The villain's stupidity surpasses Bond villains and that is saying something. "Oh shit, I have all these faceless mooks, but I somehow left my Citadel undefended!" Yeah...okay. I get that his "breeders" were so important to him, but still. This feels like a half-ass reason for them to turn back and keep the action going because I don't think there was anyone in the theater who didn't see "the green-place is gone" coming. the citadel wasn't undefended; I'm not sure if you somehow just missed the ending scene but the large majority of the war boys were still at the citadel by the time furiosa returned Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelCityOutlaw Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 saying "I was bored" isn't a valuable critique and as such nothing valuable can be gained from responding to it Yeah, but the reason that I was bored was because I found a lot of the action fairly repetitive. To be fair, that's probably just the nature of the movie being one huge chase scene, but for me the best action sequences were actually the fight between Furiosa and Max as well as the part where the pregnant bride eventually dies simply because they were a change of pace from the usual cars slamming into each other, lots of bullets and exploding spears. Actually, I really wasn't expecting them to go there and kill off Rosie Huntington-Whiteley's character. literally none of the characters are one-dimensional - either you don't actually know what that term means, or you weren't paying attention Fine, "one-dimensional" might not be entirely accurate, but it's not like it was ground-breaking, "omfg amazing" character development either. It was more "Max goes from not caring at all, to giving a shit about survival other than his own". How did Furiosa really change exactly besides becoming more trusting of Max? She was a determined badass who would risk everything for the women from beginning to end. Nux went from crazy "I'll do anything to get to Valhalla" to "Screw Valhalla, these people are my friends now and I like this girl named Capable". So not one-dimensional, but pretty much par for the course. the citadel wasn't undefended; I'm not sure if you somehow just missed the ending scene but the large majority of the war boys were still at the citadel by the time furiosa returned Joe literally says when he sees the rig going the other way "The Citadel! They know it's undefended!" I'm fairly certain that was like the exact quote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firebird Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Resident lurker, here. Watched it, loved it, nothing more to say on the matter. But for all that is holy; buy the damned dvd/blu-ray when it comes out and show some support for the practical effects that the movie has majestically graced us with. AngelCityOutlaw 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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