Virginia Tech Shooting

[Xelebes]

If I may, I just want to bring a bit of a personal update while I have a few minutes free, since I have forgotten to do so for the whole day today:

All the people I was still trying to get in contact with the last time I checked in here have been accounted for. They're alright.

Now, I sleep. You may resume your discussions.

That's good to hear.

[The Xyco]

There was a vigil here at UNCW tonight. The turnout was inspiring to say the least. I'd put it around three hundred, so large in fact that we ended sitting outside for more than an hour.

Though, unfortunately, a few of the people who spoke at the vigil felt the overwhelming need to use this tragedy as a springboard to go off irrelevant and disrespectful political rants about gun control, war, etc.

Here's a tip: If you go to a vigil, memorial service, or any sort of gathering intended to pay tribute to the lives of people who suffered an untimely, unfortunate, or tragic death -- do NOT turn the manner of speech into a nonsensical tirade about how getting a gun in this country is too easy for people, or how the inundation of violence glorification in our culture is the source of all crime and murder in country. Save that discussion for other venues of communication (personal interaction, writing, internet, etc). You're doing a service to no one by parading your cause with the coffins of the fallen. In fact, you are probably doing them the greatest DISRESPECT you possibly can.

For the most part, however, those who came out tonight were sincere and truly moving with their words. The UNCW community collectively sends its prayers and support to the friends and family of the lost, and to the entire Virginia Tech and Blacksburg community.

[Raziellink]

(Little late here)

It was all over on the dutch news. And i've read that that bastard nub thompson said video games are to blame again? What a dork.

It's a little scary that these shootings happen every now and then. Though weapons aren't as allowed in the Netherlands as they are in the US, it's still something that can happen everywhere.

[Bummer]

I got the news yesterday at the breakfast table. At first it sounded like regular depressive news, maniac kills students in public university, pretty much the same stuff everyday, but then I heard the deathcount.

Completely horrible.

[Citris]

I read this document once that stated there is a freedom of speech in the US.

I think people tend to forget what that means.

Any new developments on VT btw? I need to write a paper on the incident for a class ><;;

There's still repercussions to what you say. He can't legally be punished, but people can still boycott his show and he can still get completely fucked in the media.

I find it hilarious that literature is always ignored. Especially considering the guy was an English major. And hey, because all literature are harmless, just like those angry essays he wrote. Completely harmless bomb threats.

Because literature has been around for thousands of years. Mainstream-wise, TV has only been around for about 50 years, and our electronic culture is only a little over 20 years old. The only reason radio isn't blamed is because it's rarely used for fiction. Hell, even then Rock and Rap is still blamed.

I really really can't wait for the next 20 years to pass. Then maybe, just maybe, we'll see the electronic culture treated and utilized better.

[Ray Falling]

(Little late here)

It was all over on the dutch news. And i've read that that bastard nub thompson said video games are to blame again? What a dork.

It's a little scary that these shootings happen every now and then. Though weapons aren't as allowed in the Netherlands as they are in the US, it's still something that can happen everywhere.

When I was walking through my school's hallways I was thinking about how something like that is just unthinkable in our little country called Holland...

You're right it can happen everywere; if some Dutch idiot would pull a stunt like this we'd have the entire country in shock and tears for months.

Then again...we get crazy 'family drama' almost every week...

[Least100Seraphs]

Regarding the state of the killer's mind: I'm guessing 'not well'. Some talk of a 2 hour cooling off period which proves he was sane and rational. On the other hand, we have the time line...

Act 1: finds, and kills, ex-girlfriend.

Act 2: 2 hours pass.

Act 3: goes around school, trying to find the ex-girlfriend, shooting anyone that can't help him.

If he was sane, thinking straight, and acting in cold blood, why would he be trying to find his girlfriend?

Regarding the media and the blame game: it's not that surprising that news networks are looking for scapegoats. It makes them money, it appeases the masses, and besides which, televion and newspapers are losing money and customers to videogames every day.

Regarding the ensuing political debates: This massacre won't change the gun laws of the USA. Every right has its responsibility, every freedom has its cost. The cost of the freedom of gun ownership is incidents such as these, and the American citizenry has always been willing to accept that cost for their freedom.

[G_D]

This could help explain the two-hour delay.

[DragonFireKai]

This could help explain the two-hour delay.

Not the two hour gap he was talking about. He was refering to the two hour period between the West AJ Murders and the Norris Hall Massacre. Why the killer waited two hours before returning to campus and slaughtering the engineers. Especially the reports that he was asking about his girlfriend in Norris, when it seems his girlfriend was the first one he killed, more then two hours earlier. That points to the killer simply being batshit insane.

The standard response of a person who just finished off a murder and evaded the initial police sweep is that they go to ground for a few days. Try to hide, before either fleeing or killing their next victim. Serial Killers rarely use guns in a public area, so signs pointed to a run of the mill murder. They didn't account for the insanity factor.

[Flare4War]

Regarding the ensuing political debates: This massacre won't change the gun laws of the USA. Every right has its responsibility, every freedom has its cost. The cost of the freedom of gun ownership is incidents such as these, and the American citizenry has always been willing to accept that cost for their freedom.

People like to insinuate that if guns had been illegal this kid wouldn't have killed anyone. Perhaps it's not what they mean specifically but it's what is constantly implied. People will still find guns even if they're illegal.

On the other hand, I do think hand guns should blotted out of use. There is no need for them. They were designed for murder and for murder they are used. That goes for both law enforcement and civilians alike. Having the right to bear arms doesn't mean we should all have the right to wield a utensil designed for crime. What it does mean is I have the right to go buy a rifle, as well I should. I will say that I think handguns have there use in military operations but just barely, and largely because the enemy will always have them.

I am here digressing I admit, but it's one the issues this incident is going to bring up and we'll all be hearing about it for the next while.

What then can they do? Make all hand guns illegal and start performing mass repo? Not a chance. That would be a bigger failure than prohibition. Then how do they go about it? To me, the answer is the manufacturing of ammunition. Make it illegal to manufacture small rounds, and recall all handgun ammunition from retailers. People would still have handguns but when they found out that getting their hands on 9mm, 45, and 38 rounds was like making a drug transaction they'd be discouraged from buying those firearms.

Yes, I know the argument that because the mafia and drug dealers have handguns and always will the police and agents ought to have the same right. It is a good argument. I can't blame them. If I was a narc agent active in my duty, I'll admit it...I'd want the best semi-auto 9mm on the market with quad-magazine holster and access to plenty of ammunition. Notwithstanding this argument, law enforcement regularly abuse the use of handguns (as well as other firearms).

Tangent? Possibly. I think it's very relevant to the issue and incident.

[Least100Seraphs]

I'm not too concerned about the banning of guns. I'm fortunate enough not to live in the USA, nor in any war-torn area, so the chances of me being gunned down are remarkably slim.

My only point was that there will be many people trying to use this to fuel their arguments for strict gun control in the USA, but that ultimately these arguments will be ignored. The USA loves its guns, and would not allow its government to have them taken away. The USA loves its guns, and though it knows that the price of such gun laws is thousands of firearms fatalities every year, it, will not allow the government to take those firearms away. Cultural climates are aptly named - they are long-term patterns that take time to move in, and time to move out. Isolated incidents such as these, as shocking as they are, are isolated, and the effect quickly wears off.

[Flare4War]

I'm not too concerned about the banning of guns. I'm fortunate enough not to live in the USA, nor in any war-torn area, so the chances of me being gunned down are remarkably slim.

My only point was that there will be many people trying to use this to fuel their arguments for strict gun control in the USA, but that ultimately these arguments will be ignored. The USA loves its guns, and would not allow its government to have them taken away. The USA loves its guns, and though it knows that the price of such gun laws is thousands of firearms fatalities every year, it, will not allow the government to take those firearms away. Cultural climates are aptly named - they are long-term patterns that take time to move in, and time to move out. Isolated incidents such as these, as shocking as they are, are isolated, and the effect quickly wears off.

I see your point and I agree.

[Bahamut]

Although this isn't really the place to mull over philosophical details, it should be noted that guns and all weapons/firearms are banned on college campuses. That doesn't stop things like this, and a large portion of gun dealers are unlicensed.

[roguetrip99]

It doesnt surprise me that the first thing the bastard does is blame videogames. He'd blame the crucifixion of Jesus on videogames if he could.

[DragonFireKai]

People like to insinuate that if guns had been illegal this kid wouldn't have killed anyone. Perhaps it's not what they mean specifically but it's what is constantly implied. People will still find guns even if they're illegal.

On the other hand, I do think hand guns should blotted out of use. There is no need for them. They were designed for murder and for murder they are used. That goes for both law enforcement and civilians alike. Having the right to bear arms doesn't mean we should all have the right to wield a utensil designed for crime. What it does mean is I have the right to go buy a rifle, as well I should. I will say that I think handguns have there use in military operations but just barely, and largely because the enemy will always have them.

I am here digressing I admit, but it's one the issues this incident is going to bring up and we'll all be hearing about it for the next while.

What then can they do? Make all hand guns illegal and start performing mass repo? Not a chance. That would be a bigger failure than prohibition. Then how do they go about it? To me, the answer is the manufacturing of ammunition. Make it illegal to manufacture small rounds, and recall all handgun ammunition from retailers. People would still have handguns but when they found out that getting their hands on 9mm, 45, and 38 rounds was like making a drug transaction they'd be discouraged from buying those firearms.

Yes, I know the argument that because the mafia and drug dealers have handguns and always will the police and agents ought to have the same right. It is a good argument. I can't blame them. If I was a narc agent active in my duty, I'll admit it...I'd want the best semi-auto 9mm on the market with quad-magazine holster and access to plenty of ammunition. Notwithstanding this argument, law enforcement regularly abuse the use of handguns (as well as other firearms).

Tangent? Possibly. I think it's very relevant to the issue and incident.

Gun Control in relation to this event already has it's own thread in PPR.

http://www.ocremix.org/forums/showthread.php?t=9055&page=8

Please, post in PPR regularly, it's gotten kind of slow since about half the regulars there quit the site in January.

[CE]

In before revelation that gunman was a 4channer.

[Bummer]

Shoop da woop.

[Bigfoot]

My next door neighbor was talking to my Mom about this. She said her daughter in law works at the school cleaning the dorms. She was 20 minutes late to work that day, and the dorm she had to clean was the one where the first killings happened.

[Flare4War]

Gun Control in relation to this event already has it's own thread in PPR.

http://www.ocremix.org/forums/showthread.php?t=9055&page=8

Please, post in PPR regularly, it's gotten kind of slow since about half the regulars there quit the site in January.

I can't tell if this is an invitation to join the other discussion or a declaration to stfu. Maybe both.. lol

[Schwaltzvald]

I like how on a BBC radio show (also online) is discussing whether his nationality (the gunman) has any relevancy as how the news media (including BBC) keeps pointing it out. The respnse from callers, bloggers and emails had been of course its not, yet some asian students, inparticularly South Koreans, are considering leaving VaTech for fear of being discriminated just because of the gunman's nationality. Kind of like how the hi-jackers of those planes on 9/11 were of arabic/mid eastern descent, there were tons of discrimination to those of the same/similar descent...

Probably a good PPR topic but some else will have the privilige to make a thread, I won't.

I hope those students don't run away just because of that... Leaving for that reason just does no body any good...

[Neo Samus]

Thing is, its gonna happen. A lot of students are going to see an asian student and think "Oh no, are they going to shoot me?" Which sickens me to say the least......I hoping that maybe I'm wrong though.

[G_D]

Not the two hour gap he was talking about. He was refering to the two hour period between the West AJ Murders and the Norris Hall Massacre. Why the killer waited two hours before returning to campus and slaughtering the engineers. Especially the reports that he was asking about his girlfriend in Norris, when it seems his girlfriend was the first one he killed, more then two hours earlier. That points to the killer simply being batshit insane.

I was talking about the authorities' delay in alerting students/taking action, and not necessarily in response to the previous poster.

New information has emerged that may help explain a fateful two-hour delay by university officials in warning the campus of a gunman at large. According to search warrants and statements from the police, campus investigators had been busy pursuing what appears to have been a fruitless lead in the first of two shooting episodes Monday.

After two people, Emily Jane Hilscher, a freshman, and Ryan Clark, the resident adviser whose room was nearby in the dormitory, were shot dead, the campus police began searching for Karl D. Thornhill, who was described in Internet memorials as Ms. Hilscher’s boyfriend.

According to a search warrant filed by the police, Ms. Hilscher’s roommate had told the police that Mr. Thornhill, a student at nearby Radford University, had guns at his town house. The roommate told the police that she had recently been at a shooting range with Mr. Thornhill, the affidavit said, leading the police to believe he may have been the gunman.

But as they were questioning Mr. Thornhill, reports of widespread shooting at Norris Hall came in, making it clear that they had not contained the threat on campus. Mr. Thornhill was not arrested, although he continues to be an important witness in the case, the police said.

[Arek the Absolute]

Thing is, its gonna happen. A lot of students are going to see an asian student and think "Oh no, are they going to shoot me?" Which sickens me to say the least......I hoping that maybe I'm wrong though.

wow

that is really stupid

only bigots would do that

seriously come on now

[Neo Samus]

I know it's really stupid. I completely agree. But people are that stupid and ignorant sometimes.

[Arek the Absolute]

I honestly do not believe those that have the intelligence to get into college would actually believe that since one person of a certain country did an action that all of the same said country would do the same.

Plus, as stated, the motive was emotional relations problems, so if anything, people should be afraid of those that have had recent break ups or are emotionally traumatized by relation problems.

That being said, you all should be very afraid of me. Sounds stupid, right? So does one blaiming a country for one's stupid actions.