A Final Fantasy VI Album?

[zircon]

Not that we're aware of.

[Brandon Strader]

I'd totally start one if they let me. Rigth now. Rigth now.

[ectogemia]

If there isn't one pending, there should be.

And I will remix the shit out of the Serpent Trench and Awakenings.

[Nabeel Ansari]

You want quality over having a lot of people.. so you would be against letting people join the album based on if their songs passed the panel and were up to OCR standards?

Because that makes absolute perfect logical sense, Brandon.

secret ff6 album that would be "all techno" would be bad

To you.

[Brandon Strader]

Makes good enough sense. As people finish their songs for my ff2 project they sub them to the panel. Seems to be working out really well so far. But that's a project coordinated by a person. I suggested the idea of a ff6 project run by "the site", but they probably don't have the resources for that kind of thing. I dunno. It would be great.

[Monobrow]

Can we kind of cool it on new projects while the 50 others wrap up?

[Frederic Petitpas]

[........]

[Krug]

For my favorite Final Fantasy and my favorite video game soundtrack, I would gladly learn how to mix and buy that midi controller I've put off for so long. All these longs years I've had so many remixes stuck in my head, and not the skill to voice them. An open invitation to contribute to an album would be the perfect motivation.

[KyleJCrb]

There was work going on with an FF6 album, but it seems production on that screeched to a halt a few years ago.

[Thylacine]

Can we kind of cool it on new projects while the 50 others wrap up?

I hate waiting for new albums as much as the next OCR denizen, but is a backlog such a horrible thing?

I mean, we are uncertain of how things shall progress a year down the road. Our well-known mixers might suddenly find themselves very busy and unable to dedicate themselves to a project that deserves the attention of newbies and oldbies alike. Having a few rounds in the chamber for future use just helps DJP keep content on the site fresh, no matter how packed our lives get.

As long as albums get released eventually, what's the problem with a backlog?

---

If this project were to be taken seriously, I'd suggest avoiding a genre-based theme and instead go for something true to the game. We've seen the dichotomy thing a couple of times before (Xenogears and Chrono Trigger immediately come to mind) and this game practically begs for it with the Esper/Human and WoB/WoR setup.

There's 61 tracks on the OST. Maybe have each track be associated with a particular Esper or Magicite (having the instrumentation or genre based on the type of attack/defense move the Esper pulls)? There's a list of... 27 tracks right there, with 16 character themes and 11 "extra" tracks.

It wouldn't have to be a comprehensive project, since (as the point's been made) pretty much every single track has had at least a submission, if not acceptance, in OCR. And similar tracks could be combined (Locke/Rachel, Celes/Aria de Mezzo Caraterre, etc.). That'd cut down on the creation time a bit.

I've always thought it was odd that nobody has proposed this for a project, given FF7's pre-release hype.

And forgive me for rambling - it happens when I post late at night.

EDIT: Also, I don't want to come across as pretentious or demanding or anything. I'm just throwing out suggestions if someone does wish to take the reins for this.

[Monobrow]

I hate waiting for new albums as much as the next OCR denizen, but is a backlog such a horrible thing?

I mean, we are uncertain of how things shall progress a year down the road. Our well-known mixers might suddenly find themselves very busy and unable to dedicate themselves to a project that deserves the attention of newbies and oldbies alike. Having a few rounds in the chamber for future use just helps DJP keep content on the site fresh, no matter how packed our lives get.

I don't think you understand all the work that goes into a project. It's a really big deal, a lot of work, organization, and the bigger the OST, the bigger your resource pool for remixers you have to draw from. It may seem like resources on this site are unlimited, but they really are not, especially w/ people that will stick w/ you, make super high quality music, etc. etc... Getting a couple dozen people to do in unison is actually really pressing.

My point being, if they are all involved in about 4-5 other projects (which a lot of them are) then finding the time to make a song, let alone the best song ever (which would be a prerequisite for something as awesome as FFVI IMO)is going to be harder.

I know a lot of people that won't join projects just because they are sick of working on them. I also know a lot of people that won't take on project songs for their favorite games just because they feel obligated to work on other songs they promised to do for another project. Having 3 deadlines in the same month can really suck. What's more, I know people that join every project ever because they love all the songs, but have bit off more than they can chew and then drop everything. I personally don't blame them, because if things were a bit more spread out w/ starting actual projects, the resource pool would be easier to dip into w/out people getting overwhelmed (and sad/depressed because they don't have the time to remix their favorite song)

Then there's the fact that there's such a huge backlog. I have songs on projects that are to be released that are at least a year or two old, if not more, that do not accurately represent my current ability etc. at all. It does suck to have to wait 2 (or more) years after you've finished a song for it to be released.

My point is for a lot of remixers here, that have expressed desires not to have so many projects being run at once, not because they are selfish evil people, but because they love all this video game music but can only stretch themselves so far.

FFVI, being as popular as it is, will obviously eventually be done, and probably by more than one group of people, and it's so huge an OST that I am sure that anyone that really really wants to be a part of it will eventually be able to be...

With a backlog of other projects that will be released within the next couple of years, I'd personally rather have a breather on starting new projects for a bit... So people that have spent so much time working on them, can have a break, a chance to have their music actually catch up to their current state of mind *_*

And while you're waiting, why not enjoy upcoming projects like:

Wild Arms, BadAss, DKC3, MMX, Kirby Superstar, SD3, Super Mario 64, FFIX, Unsung Heroes, Lufia II, TMNT3, Zelda... etc. etc. etc.

[Brandon Strader]

I don't think community support would be that much of an issue for FF6. And I wouldn't see it as ff6 "taking artists away from other projects" so much as enabling artists to work on something they want to work on... Maybe they just don't want to remix Dragon Warrior because the sources are too difficult to remix Hehe... It's not that some bigger project is taking them away from DW.

And as far as I could tell the biggest bulk of the OCR projects has been completed and is either in evaluation or is evaluated. Albums like DKC3, Maverick Rising, Wild Arms, Milkyway Wishes, BadAss. And projects like FF9, Unsung Heroes, and Super Mario 64 have deadlines set for December or January.

It's true some of the smaller projects are struggling and I'm not sure why. A project like Dragon Warrior deserves to have a lot of mixers on it and doesn't, for years, but then Bahamut starts a project every other week () and they get a lot of claims pretty quick. All I can conclude is that it probably does have to do with the melodicness of the sources or how easy they would be to remix, but maybe there's some other thing that goes into it. Maybe the people running smaller projects don't have enough community reputation (good or bad) to get those kinds of claims. *shrug* I know when I was running FF9 that I was pressured into giving the album away by prolific mixers who wouldn't join the project unless it was run by someone more popular. So there is a popularity contest aspect to it rather than being all about the music.

[Monobrow]

Who said anything about DW?

Way to miss the point Brandon. *_*

[Brandon Strader]

Hehehe

While we're on the topic of Dragon Warrior...

http://ocremix.org/forums/showthread.php?t=26229

I agree that some mixers who can should sign on and help get it going

[Meteo Xavier]

I agree that some mixers who can should sign on and help get it going

On that note, were you ever able to get "Oh I'm a Flamelet" polished up and exported to .WAV?

[Rozovian]

There's always gonna be ppl who go "whoa, a remix project of my fav game" when/if they see that it's being worked on, and would jump on the opportunity to join. Then there are some ocr regulars who are project whores and try to be on every album (we don't mind, we like having ppl on our projects), there's franchise, console, composer, or genre fanboys, and ppl looking for a way into the community who can't _yet_ get posted on ocr, or who want something to work on in between subs. Maybe the direction of an album gets the attention of someone with an affinity and spacialty in that sound, style or genre. Maybe an all-metal, or all-electronica, or all-marimba album would appeal to some remixers.

So there's always some ppl around who'll do a mix for project x. Whether there's enough for a 3+ disc behemoth or a modest 10-track thing is another matter. I thin the best way to run a project would be to focus on some central tracks, a dozen or so. If ppl come in and want to do other tracks, that's fine too. By having a more easily achieved goal, the project will likely move faster, even if it means it might end up a smaller project.

We already have behemoths in the works, and they're moving sloooooooow. No new behemoths plz, unless they become behemoths naturally.

[Meteo Xavier]

We need to stop doing behemoth projects with strict genre guidelines anyway. It sounds awesome on paper, but from my experience in trying to work on one, it doesn't reflect reality or help it progress. At some point artistic direction has to reflect what people are going to actually want to listen to, otherwise a shitload of time, effort and resources are likely wasted - for a community like this, dedicated though we are, it is not reflective of reality.

I personally think project album should be capped at 15-18 tracks or single CD album projects that focus on the more on the tracks listeners are going to actually flock to with about 25% attention on neglected tracks (or a sortof medley of them, because its nice to count them, but there's a reason they're neglected in the first place).

Albums should also be a good way to invite new blood into the community. What I did with SD3 once we've exercised all the available remixers of interest was to start looking elsewhere. Youtube gets a lot of crap for having horrible remixes on it, but I've found several excellent willing artists (Archangel being one of them) who have agreed to come on board. Another good one was Gamedev.net - I found several excellent composers who were looking for work and looking for ways to get their skills out there - 2+2 = 4. That's a great way to kill four birds with one stone.

I know few if any are going to listen to me (and this topic is getting pretty derailed now), but if you're looking for decent, logical ways to improve the Project system on this community, those are some good starts.

[Thylacine]

I don't think you understand all the work that goes into a project. It's a really big deal, a lot of work, organization, and the bigger the OST, the bigger your resource pool for remixers you have to draw from. It may seem like resources on this site are unlimited, but they really are not, especially w/ people that will stick w/ you, make super high quality music, etc. etc... Getting a couple dozen people to do in unison is actually really pressing.

My point being, if they are all involved in about 4-5 other projects (which a lot of them are) then finding the time to make a song, let alone the best song ever (which would be a prerequisite for something as awesome as FFVI IMO)is going to be harder.

Oh, I totally understand. I've worked on (non-remix) group projects where there were only 5-6 people to deal with, and even that was an ultra-stressful thing. Often times, at least two people were MIA, and it wrecked the rest of the work being done. I'm not discounting how much work goes into an album at all, and it astounds me that there can be such great collaborative works.

I'm just saying that there's going to be a large lead time regardless. Why not let people take advantage of that? Perhaps plan deadlines around other projects, since this is going to be an undertaking that will involved a large number of OCR people. Restrict song acceptance to one song/person and keep people who are involved in multiple projects to a minimum. If they free up and there's a song available from dropouts, then there should be no problem. It sounds really totalitarian written like that, but this will be a high-demand album if it's announced. Why not use other album participation as a criteria for track acceptance?

I'm not going to pretend that I know what goes on behind the white/grey of the OCR front screen, because I don't. I just know that there's always a way to get from point A to point B if it's given proper planning and keeps things in a comfort zone.

My point is for a lot of remixers here, that have expressed desires not to have so many projects being run at once, not because they are selfish evil people, but because they love all this video game music but can only stretch themselves so far.

I get that entirely. But if you asked these fans if they'd rather not have an album for a game at all or have an album they didn't get to put a remix in, what do you think their answer would be?

FFVI, being as popular as it is, will obviously eventually be done, and probably by more than one group of people, and it's so huge an OST that I am sure that anyone that really really wants to be a part of it will eventually be able to be...

My only concern with this type of thinking is that it's a postponement attitude. When will the backlog be reduced enough to consider a new project, especially one of a potentially large magnitude? Who makes that call?

With a backlog of other projects that will be released within the next couple of years, I'd personally rather have a breather on starting new projects for a bit... So people that have spent so much time working on them, can have a break, a chance to have their music actually catch up to their current state of mind *_*

And while you're waiting, why not enjoy upcoming projects like:

Wild Arms, BadAss, DKC3, MMX, Kirby Superstar, SD3, Super Mario 64, FFIX, Unsung Heroes, Lufia II, TMNT3, Zelda... etc. etc. etc.

I know, I know - there are a ton of projects coming, and I'm looking forward to most of them. But some of those are under review or close to being done.

I'm not saying the projects should start RIGHT NOW HURRY OR ALL TRACKS WILL BE TAKEN. I'm just saying that the planning stages should be the ones where the most time is concentrated. If the project were to be started right now and interest tested (as it has been with this thread), then names could be taken down for tentative involvement after the backlog has thinned out. Let people rest, but plan something for the future.

---

As far as your quote on the quality of your work in contrast to where you are as an artist in the present, that's the only real problem I see with the backlog. It's the disadvantage of time. That being said, isn't that an inherent issue with albums in general? Wouldn't there still be a long difference of time between your track submission and its posting on OCR?

EDIT: Also, Meteo Xavier's suggestion on using albums to encourage new ReMixers to enter the track is a good idea. Perhaps, if my earlier suggestion of Human/Esper were to be considered, have the tracks be divided into new people who don't have a track accepted in OCR (Human) and people who do (Espers). Or Balance/Ruin. Separate based on how much community participation the person has. It would also encourage people who aren't swamped by projects to participate in the album.

[Brandon Strader]

It'd probably take 2 years or more to make a good ff6 album.

[Meteo Xavier]

EDIT: Also, Meteo Xavier's suggestion on using albums to encourage new ReMixers to enter the track is a good idea. Perhaps, if my earlier suggestion of Human/Esper were to be considered, have the tracks be divided into new people who don't have a track accepted in OCR (Human) and people who do (Espers). Or Balance/Ruin. Separate based on how much community participation the person has. It would also encourage people who aren't swamped by projects to participate in the album.

That's also kinda the opposite of the rest of what I'm going for. That's a needlessly complicated design for a project that won't improve the quality or focus of the content - it's just a concept to have just to have a concept. It would also throw off the balance of the album, as people will download the side with all the remixer names they know and love much more than the ones with new people on it.

[Frederic Petitpas]

[........]

[Avatar of Justice]

We need to stop doing behemoth projects with strict genre guidelines anyway. It sounds awesome on paper, but from my experience in trying to work on one, it doesn't reflect reality or help it progress. At some point artistic direction has to reflect what people are going to actually want to listen to, otherwise a shitload of time, effort and resources are likely wasted - for a community like this, dedicated though we are, it is not reflective of reality.

THIS. THIS. THIS. As a pure consumer of OCR tracks (I don't know anything about composition), I don't listen to the more genrish tracks and my good friend who loves game music has acquired a distaste of OCR in general because of this phenomenon. I know at some point you guys are artists doing what you do for free, but unless its just masturbation I'm assuming you guys care somewhat what the consumers think.

[Bahamut]

Well sometimes when I see some names I'm just not downloading them because I expect how it's gonna sound like. Albums like this should be free for all with no limit of claims, then the best tracks could voted to make it. Restricting things to an already known little circle is the best way to go IMO, even tho I like some of those remixers.

The problem with such an approach is that it can punish some hard endeavors by others, or cause some drama from an arbitrary vote deciding what gets placed on an album. It's harder to control the end product when you have a myriad of people involved with such an approach, and there's little guarantee that people would want to be involved with such an approach where they aren't guaranteed that the final release will be coherent or have a quality level they desire & want to associate their name with.

THIS. THIS. THIS. As a pure consumer of OCR tracks (I don't know anything about composition), I don't listen to the more genrish tracks and my good friend who loves game music has acquired a distaste of OCR in general because of this phenomenon. I know at some point you guys are artists doing what you do for free, but unless its just masturbation I'm assuming you guys care somewhat what the consumers think.

There's a lot of people in the community that have a variety of views on this subject - I've heard a lot of calls for there to be more coherency with the albums via concepts or genres. I've seen some that want variety of genres, and others express indifference as well. The only thing I can say is that it's up to an album director to choose how he/she wants to approach an album. Same with regular mixes. If an artist gets inspiration or wants a challenge, they'll do things their way, and as a consumer you have to accept that. Whether you like things that way is a personal preference. I have a friend who's not so much a fan of OCR because he prefers covers. It's just the way it is.

[Brandon Strader]

I can understand wanting coherence between songs but when you're making a community album, the point is to have everyone's unique vision and sound of their work. That's how I feel anyway. Even if every song was orchestral or something of that nature, they'd still use different samples and levels of articulation, and volume. I just feel like if you're going for coherence in that way you should do it yourself, if you're making a community thing then you should embrace everyone's differences and strengths.

[Meteo Xavier]

Well sometimes when I see some names I'm just not downloading them because I expect how it's gonna sound like. Albums like this should be free for all with no limit of claims, then the best tracks could voted to make it. Restricting things to an already known little circle is the best way to go IMO, even tho I like some of those remixers.

Again, experience dictates otherwise. We had several people on SD3 who had claims on several tracks and by the time we cleaned them out, a lot of them contributed nothing but a vacuum to suck up our time.

Every time a major project is announced, the well-known remixers pick all the good ones while the wannabes pick like 3-5 tracks and it becomes a huge fucking mess and elitist power struggle - not a fair chance for newbies to get recognized and not a fair distribution of content.

A logical and fair solution is to have the project director collect names of those interested, with the number of tracks they want to do, and assign them him or herself. I myself would also limit each remixer to one, MAYBE two, track slots, because as I've learned, most people don't get their fucking third or fourth tracks in until you bug the shit out of them to do it. That's bad enough trying to coax them for one in the first place.

Sorry if I sound pissed, I just found out some dick got access to my bank card and started buying cheap car parts, but you understand the basic message. A successful project is one that's organized and managed well and that requires heavy focus on practical applications and logic.