Fratto

How so? How is you laying overdriven guitar over someone else's non-guitar track any different than someone rocking out on an oboe during a Metallica track? Are you really going to say that arrangement and specific instrumentation are strictly classical ideas? This thought process is fallacious. This is wrong. It's like saying that a minor scale is ambiguous without chordal context. It's still minor. Melodies almost always imply a mode. Saying that a melody alone is ambiguous is a fallacious statement. The aim and purpose of art is not necessarily self expression. It has already been pointed out to you that composers also score for a living. This doesn't exclude self-expression, but nullifies point (1). Art is not exclusive. Music and literature are not exclusive. Opera, poetry, musical theater, cinema, etc. all contain undeniable elements of both. So if points 1-4 are all wrong, then your conclusion (and the entirety of 'The Misnomer of Modern Music') can only be described as fallacious. I did not prejudge you. Your views and thoughts on music, as expressed by you in this thread, are overtly Western European and have little to no Eastern or African influence. I know you're Asian. You link to your Facebook and you post videos of yourself. You're clearly Asian. I asked what the first generation of your family to come to the States was. You're very removed from Eastern music. I'm not saying that the bands are not from Asia. I'm saying they are probably extremely Westernized. The amount of Western music coming from the East is huge. Actual Eastern music is a failure according to your own posts. If you actually listen to, enjoy, and value actual Asian music, then you need to restate just about everything you have posted on this forum because everything you've expressed about your views on music would then be fallacious. Musical taste is not logical. I know that making logical flow charts is great and fun, plus you get to use big words in the overly long titles, but it doesn't make your flow charts any less fallacious.. But will my great great grandchildren know? Fallacious. Since you are not Yngwie or any of the other "self-serving" metal musicians, it is fairly arrogant and fallacious of you to slap your own feeling and thought upon their performances and desires. Rock music is not deviation from classical convention. Rock is an extension of jazz and blues, which are more an extension of African music (with a Western harmonics) than anything else. It's a subtle fallacy that rock is the opposite of classical. You apparently have no idea why bands form. I'm getting really tired of Yngwie being used as an example and the blatant double standard that you your fanboy excitement creates within every point that you try to make. He performs violin concertos on electric guitar and shapes them into metal concertos, which you view as a cardinal sin. The man can play a handful of instruments, but cannot do his own drum work and rarely does his own vocal work. He also hosts an entire band and is known as a "bandleader" He's featured on tribute albums, meaning that he's sinning against Ozzy because only Ozzie could possibly understand the depth and meaning of "Mr. Crowley" and Yngwie is just ruining it. According to your own fallacious posts, Yngwie should not need a bass player, should learn to play the drums, and should singing his own lyrics. But in a twist, Yngwie is also inherently unmusical due to his use of lyrics in music. Enough with Yngwie. He's a very talented guitarist and he knows his way around some classical music, but for all practical purposes, he's just a Satriani clone. You should be focusing more on Prince or Steve Vai. Those two can (and on rare occasion do) actually play all the parts to their music. Once again, Beethoven would be a far cry from a great composer by your definition due to the simple fact that he could not play his own music unless it was strictly piano and a simple viola part. You are saying that the ultimate composer only writes solo literature with possible piano accompaniment. Fallacious. Fallacious! A lot of Williams' music borrows pretty heavily. Star Wars in particular owes a healthy debt to Gustav Holst. Do you think that he really needed to have the vision of Lucas to write for Vader, or do you think 'The Bringer of War' was a good enough basis to write about a bad guy? Who decides that the dichotomy is fallacious? You are only gaining truth by capitalizing upon your own ideas - ones that the majority of musicians in this thread find fallacious. Actually, there are several midi programs that use a musical staff. Also, knowing the notes on a piano does by no means indicate the ability to play the piano. Similarly, sequencing on a piano roll does not make something pianistic. I did, and I found that your logic is fallacious.Fallacious. Fallacious!

I think you must have either missed my post from earlier, or you ignored it due to my sarcasm. Reading it could have helped you. I'm not going to sift through your numerous posts just to quote them, but you'll know what I'm referring to. I am a classical musician. I am a studio musician. I am a jazz musician. I was, and may be again, a rock/pop/whatever musician. I don't feel any more or less replaceable when I'm playing tuba in the symphony as I do when I'm playing bass trombone in the jazz orchestra. Grouping musicians together by venue is foolish and wrong. Beethoven was actually my specific example in my post of a composer needing performers. Beethoven could only play his own piano and solo viola pieces. He would have a hard time accompanying himself, and would therefore need a piano player (or another violist) if he ever wanted to perform accompanied solos. Symphonies! If you think his symphonies were not a huge part of vast popularity and ability to transcend generations, then you're also foolish and wrong. Now imagine little Ludwig with his viola trying to play the 5th Symphony. Awesome! Or no. He could not play trombone. He could not play bassoon. He could only play one string part at a time. Guess what he needed and used? Performers! It's not rocket science! You also conveniently dismissed Dhsu's orchestra program. It mentioned only the composer and none of the performers. This is how it goes all the time. No one ever goes to the symphony and sees "Conductor Joe, Trumpets Bob, George, and Frank, Clarinets Gina, Ashley, and Shannon! Oh, and that Beethoven guy wrote the song." No! You have dozens of very talented people all grouped under one heading which is usually only three letters long (e.g. DSO), while the front of the program and an entire article inside are dedicated to the composer and another paragraph (at least) about the song. You have a line with your name and instrument stapled in back. All the glory belongs to the performer, though. Hardly. Music without words isn't real music. Pop punk isn't music because it's lyrically driven, therefore those people aren't musicians. This is ludicrous. That's like saying that the Beastie Boys are not musicians because of their rap (lyric driven) style. Then what do you think of "Transitions" in terms of music? It's incredible and instrumental. Are they more valuable during that song than they are when they're singing or rapping? Is Eric Clapton or Stevie Ray Vaughan any less valuable to music because they are also singers? No to all questions. No. The human voice is a fantastic instrument. The reason that pop music doesn't change past four chords with one rhythm and one dynamic (this is an ignorant fallacy, but for the sake of your argument we'll pretend) is because since it's vocally driven it doesn't need to. It's not necessarily lyrically driven as much as it is vocally driven. The intensity, musicality, interpretation, feeling, emotion, and soul are all in the voice of the singer and the mood of the harmonies. The voice is an incredible instrument. Learn that. Thieves evade the public eye all the time. Also, generations forget things. The number of people that think Soft Cell was the original performer of "Tainted Love" is huge. No one even knows any other songs by Soft Cell. Their biggest hit isn't even their own. How many people know that? The song was hugely popular and remains a staple of 1980s culture. Fast forward 150 years. If anyone remembers Soft Cell, they won't remember that their only hit was a rip off of a funk/soul song. I doubt that Beethoven stole all his songs, but I like to play devil's advocate on occasion. As for your views on music and your claims, I'd be curious to know how far removed from you are from immigration. You have a dominantly Western view of music and Eastern music probably scares you. Music outside the US and Western Europe is very rhythmic and some have no pitch at all, though the music may be downright sacred to them. Interpretation can mean many things. If I crescendo a little on a long note to make it go somewhere even though it's not specifically written to, then that could be interpretation. Maybe a rubato somewhere that isn't marked to. You consider that a cardinal sin. Maybe you overlay sloppy electric guitar (with your embellishments) over the top of different kinds of music that doesn't specifically call for electric guitar. That's also interpretation. Other people may consider distortion and embellishments a cardinal sin. It works both ways. Lurk moar in music.

Inaccurate stereotypes. This whole paragraph is a waste. Yeah, only the very serious orchestras are worth looking into. I know Boston, London, and Chicago are all too caught up in the pops movement. Also, these guys can't play pop music very well because they're trained musicians. They would want to emulate the pop songs too much. Pop music is never emulated or replicated like classical music is. By the way, the point he was making is that you said all classical music is performer driven and that no one cares about the composers. This statement is false and his ad with only the composer's name and not a single performer name is a good argument against your original post. Okay, let's use the word arranging instead, since that's essentially what remixing is. Video game music is so lax that we can arrange it any way we want. Classical music, however, is never arranged due to the restrictions placed upon classical music. Playing the trombone and bassoon was just another side of the coin when Beethoven wrote the 5th Symphony.

I've got an update after I figure out what the hell is wrong with my FTP.

- Not starting jazz soon enough - Being terrible at the piano - Teaching myself trombone instead of taking lessons - Majoring in Music Education - Not drinking enough beer prior to trying to play The usual.

Fishy has this.

Mappy Land (NES) Tengen's Rolling Thunder (NES) My Smash Bros cart stopped working and a friend of mine was willing to give me his since he had gotten the band new Melee version. The only thing was that I had to take his entire bag of N64 games. I got a few gems, but got a lot of games for this thread. Diddy Kong Racing Pokemon Stadium Quest 64 Flying Dragon Pokemon Snap Superman

Sorry, didn't see your high horse over there.

I didn't see any n's the first time I read this.

http://www.ocremix.org/forums/showthread.php?t=626 to say the least.

im in

The word "piration" embiggens this thread.

Awesome. Let me know if you need something.

You're a damned genius. I'm going to start PMing (or emailing, if possible) people that haven't updated in a while. People like RK seem to do great deals with little time, making it possible for him to still be with the game even though he's way behind. After seeing people's plans on whether they are still interested in working on this project (and trying to catch up quickly), we'll be able to assess which songs are going to need to mixers. It might also be a nice idea to try and get some more posted remixers in addition to Sixto on board now that VotL and ToF have wrapped up. I, for one, tend to be a sucker for anything Mr. Hsu does. Also, artwork?

Proof-read. EDIT - I guess if you're filming then you don't need to spell words correctly, but grammar still needs to be up to reasonable standards.

I see what you did there. Oh, yeah. Texas.

I don't like drama either, but I especially don't like the number of times Pocket has flaked out on this project. We've had almost a year now and he has yet to do many things that could have been easily done in the first 4-6 months. I also understand that you don't want to jump in and take over, but you are the co-coordinator and you've been the only sense of leadership since the very beginning. The fact that Pocket has all but abandoned the project makes you the only coordinator of any sort. You're the leader now, whether you feel like declaring it or not. Coop, Tensei has some suggestions for you on the project boards about possible cheap/free options. If none of those work and you're open to the idea, I'm confident that someone else can take your arrangement and apply their skills and software to your work. The arrangement would be all you and someone else can jump in with their sounds on a midi of yours or something. I'd hate to lose you from the project due to Pocket's miscommunication on where your sounds would be last year. That would depend on how many of these extremely outdated WIPs get dropped from the project. RK, for example, has a great start on the boards that hasn't been updated since the first WIP date. After we get our leadership sorted out, then decisions can be made as to what songs will be available again.

So we're losing at least one mixer, several WIPs haven't been updated since the fist WIP date, and we've been without solid leadership since the first few months of the year. Howsabout we get this shit on the ball. Fishy, step up to the plate and help us get this thing moving along. Pocket, are you in or out? If you don't take your deadlines and quality standards seriously, then how can we? Seriously. It might be time for you to cut your losses. We need someone dedicated to this project to be it's coordinator, and you haven't been very dedicated. I would be tempted to blame our lack of activity on your total lack of leadership. - Two songs (Prophet's too, honestly) are done. - A handful are getting close. - We've got two (maybe three or more) songs open. - We need more mixers. - We need a new WIP date in, say, late January as a final "get something recent up or get off the project" deadline for those who haven't updated since March-May. - Several songs are not even close to par. Mine is one. And Pocket's is a prime example of another. Get to work, everyone.

Some gardening shoes, a coffee pot, getting my iPod fixed, gift cards, a Rahr Beer hoodie, Guinness hat, a grill. Oh, and a homebrew kit. Mmmm beer.

Shit happens.

Did the song I sent to your gmail not get delivered or something?

O Come, O Come, Emanuel is really great. EDIT: Oh shit, I failed.

The booze, well, it's in me (or maybe not anymore). Consequently, it's also in Texas. I sent the mp3 to your gmail around 3:30-4:00pm.

Sorry dude. I got drunk last night and emailed the final copy to myself... just noticed it in my inbox this afternoon. I just sent it to you for real this time if you're still interested. It's really conservative, but I'd say that having so little time on it, plus sticking it in 4/4 I did alright. Do what you want with it.

Two days until WIPs according to this site, two days late according to the project board. Start posting your shit.