Windows 7

[SenPi]

stuff

Allright, I can appreciate that. I was just basing most of my comments about you out of speculation. I was gonna say what darke said up there as well.

Anyways, in my experiences I have always found unix/linux to be FAR easyer to code in than windows (especially for general purpose command line type programs)

also btw, every linux/mac either comes with a c/c++ compiler or it is very easy to get one. for the most part its gcc (c compiler) and g++(c++ compiler). If it doesnt come with it, its usually very easy to get it

apt-get install gcc

or

yum install gcc

etc.

but yeah, Ive never every had a problem with mac keyboards or mice, always super responsive for me.

[Sengin]

Just wanted to address this. Using Putty to connect to a UNIX machine is not using a Windows machine to do your programming. You're not developing anything on the Windows box. You're doing all of your developing on the UNIX machine.

Haha, I know. I was saying how there was a program for Windows that allows me to connect easily. I meant that when I said "In this case, I am...". Though I do agree that it is not clear, at all.

Anyways, in my experiences I have always found unix/linux to be FAR easyer to code in than windows (especially for general purpose command line type programs)

What do you mean by "easier to code in"? Because I find it much more painstaking, because I have to use pico, vi, vim, etc..., all command line applications, which I find quite annoying. I much prefer Visual Studio and NetBeans IDE for programming. Or do you mean easier as in "all I gotta do is type 'vim Hello World.c'?"

but yeah, Ive never every had a problem with mac keyboards or mice, always super responsive for me.

I've never had a nice keyboard for the mac, it's always been the standard keyboard you get with the desktop and it's always been awful (and unadjustable, as far as the physical height of the keyboard off the ground).

[The Pezman]

This is veering off into dangerous territory. I don't want to mod anything but I don't want to see this get locked either.

Here's a question: What are the confirmed new features of Windows 7?

[Hector]

Minesweeper

[prophetik music]

Hey, let's talk about Macs/linux in the Windows 7 thread.

edited, it's correct now. ebb and flow, you know.

confirmed new features? they cloned the mac dock, made the ribbon menu system from office 2007 standard for all major windows programs (like paint and the like), and they're beefing up the performance-related features of the os so that standard copy-paste actually works all the time now.

[Brome]

Although the beta version of Vienna exists (but I don't think we can acquire it), there is no release date, yet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_7

It says that it's going to be released three years after Vista, which came out January the 30th of 2007 ...

[alt.slack]

Ha... ha...

HAAA HAAA HAAAA HAAAAAA HAAAAAAA!!

This is Microsoft we're talking about here, right?

Yeah, as a Mac user myself I never did like the "Mac vs. PC" ads. If you want to make your point, make your point, but don't be smug about it and don't belittle the competition...

I don't think he's being smug about it all, he just stated facts about the Mac ads. As a lifelong PC user and someone who can't find a single reason why anyone would want to spend that much extra on a Mac just so they can use a very very limiting operating system is way beyond me. Being an audiophile and huge archiver of music and video, OSX is the last thing I'd ever want to use. It doesn't even have a good media player.

[alt.slack]

[quote name=

I hope that was a reasonable' date=' well-thought out description of what I, at least, enjoy more about Mac OS. I didn't belittle Windows users for their choice (cost is a big consideration), and I still recommend it for people who want nothing more than to write up documents and check their email. But if you're a power user who likes to do as much with a computer as you can, then I would definitely recommend Mac OSX. And with EFIX you don't have to buy a ridiculously expensive Mac Pro either.

Also note that we have a pretty good idea of what Snow Leopard is going to do (OpenCL, tighter sized programs, etc), but I don't know what Microsoft really has up their sleeve for 7.

[MaxFrost]

alt, you're way off. A power user is essentially one who wishes to use their machine to it's fullest capabilities. There's a reason why so much art and production is done on Macs. It's not because it's "simple", it's because the best software available is made for mac, and macs put this software to it's best use.

If I were to pick a true os for power users, it'd be either Mac or a *unix derivative, not windows. Microsoft has been opening up more and more options, but it still has to serve to the lowest common denominator, which is the happy go lucky user who barely knows how to access email.

If you're ragging on OSX's layout, you obviously haven't used it recently at all. It takes a bit of getting used to, but so does linux. And there's far more power user options that are easier to get to in OSX then it's Windows counterparts.

Macs have a beauty about their interface because _EVERYTHING_ is standardized, which means the same key combination that works in one program will work THE SAME EXACT WAY in another. You'll find menu options in the same place irregardless of who built the program.

Windows is getting better in the UI department, but it still has a ways to go. Vista's start menu is a good example of how it's evolving.

Edit: Anywho, this is a thread about Windows 7, stop talking about other OS's, it's trolling

[noTuX]

I'm not really into the whole operation system wars and technical aspects and all, plus I don't care enough to keep up with the news, but I can't help but wonder why did Microsoft decide to start working on a whole new operating system?

Why can't they just take the steps to improve Vista? Ya know, get rid of useless features (UAC!!!), improve performance, security, and compatibility issues.

IMO, it just seems like Microsoft is trying to keep up with the Joneses.

[MaxFrost]

I believe windows 7 is an attempt to get away from the windows vista stigma. If vista had performed better in the market place, I would guarantee you that they'd be injecting these features right into it instead of forking windows 7 and working on that instead.

UAC was a fantastic idea (I use it all the time) but it needs to be reworked. Once I say okay to let a program do it's thing, I shouldn't have to okay the file copyovers and etc. However, I understand why it does that right now, and that's because there are users who don't always know what they're doing.

There's a lot of good UI stuff happening in windows 7 which will help bring it up to par with OSX. Better window management, tossing the sidebar, which is only midly useful. There's also some good optimization being done with the fork, which will mean that there's a good chance that windows 7 will run better on older hardware then vista currently does.

[BlueMage]

I'm not really into the whole operation system wars and technical aspects and all, plus I don't care enough to keep up with the news, but I can't help but wonder why did Microsoft decide to start working on a whole new operating system?

They're not. WIndows 7 is Windows Vista 2.0, just a different name so as to avoid the (ignorant) bad press of Vista.

Why can't they just take the steps to improve Vista? Ya know, get rid of useless features (UAC!!!), improve performance, security, and compatibility issues.

UAC isn't useless - were it linux, you'd be typing a password every time. And as a non-administrator user, you DO type a password every time.

Vista's security - out of the box - shits all over any version of Windows previous. They've actually thought about the design of the OS with security in mind this time. Performance .... well, run it on the appropriate hardware and you'll have wonderful performance. I know I do. I don't have what would be considered a top-end beast anymore.

As for compatability, the reason for incompatability most of the time is that previously, the Windows system folder and Program Files system folder were whores - open to everyone. In Vista, they're prudes. Which is great from a security perspective. Unfortunately, software developers didn't want to change the way they've always done things, so things broke.

IMO, it just seems like Microsoft is trying to keep up with the Joneses.

That, unfortunately, is the name of the game in marketing. It's all one-up-manship and me-too-ism.

[alt.slack]

alt, you're way off. A power user is essentially one who wishes to use their machine to it's fullest capabilities. There's a reason why so much art and production is done on Macs. It's not because it's "simple", it's because the best software available is made for mac, and macs put this software to it's best use.

If I were to pick a true os for power users, it'd be either Mac or a *unix derivative, not windows. Microsoft has been opening up more and more options, but it still has to serve to the lowest common denominator, which is the happy go lucky user who barely knows how to access email.

If you're ragging on OSX's layout, you obviously haven't used it recently at all. It takes a bit of getting used to, but so does linux. And there's far more power user options that are easier to get to in OSX then it's Windows counterparts.

Macs have a beauty about their interface because _EVERYTHING_ is standardized, which means the same key combination that works in one program will work THE SAME EXACT WAY in another. You'll find menu options in the same place irregardless of who built the program.

Windows is getting better in the UI department, but it still has a ways to go. Vista's start menu is a good example of how it's evolving.

Edit: Anywho, this is a thread about Windows 7, stop talking about other OS's, it's trolling

I was just talking about the two standard OS's out there. Windows and OSX. I use Ubuntu more often than my windows install and love it. But as far as the two default OS's go Windows offers far more functionality and customizability than OSX.

Sorry but saying Macs are better somehow for art and music just shows your biased. Photoshop is the exact same program on the PC as it is on the Mac and it's always performed far better for me under XP than any OSX machine I've used it on. Ableton Live and Sony Acid work better on XP than on OSX and offer far more configurability and control and silly Logic. Avid destroys Final Cut for video editing hands down and again runs smoother on the PC.

If I want to get the most possible use out of my computer I would always stick with the PC side. I have the most control over what components I want to put inside my computer, I won't get dramatically overcharged for the same hardware. I have far more software available on the PC. Again back to the point I made in my original post on this matter, there isn't even a decent media player on OSX. OSX just lacks the software support of it's competitors.

As far as interface theres a few things that OSX still doesn't allow you to do. When I'm working on a word document I don't want to see anything on screen but the doc. On OSX I still can't easily maximize a window to full screen and have it locked to the edges. Theres still part of the wallpaper visible. Just distracting. Why when I close every instance of the program does the program still remain open taking up system resources??? Theres no explanation you can give that will make that seem logical. Every mac desktop I've seem is always far more cluttered and random feeling than any power users Window desktop I've seen. The fact that they need to add so called features like expose and the hot corners to get around a cluttered desktop instead of properly designing window layout in the beginning just shows that apple never thinks that far forward.

[noTuX]

They're not. WIndows 7 is Windows Vista 2.0, just a different name so as to avoid the (ignorant) bad press of Vista.

I see. Thanks for clearing that up for me. Like I said, I haven't been keeping up with it.

UAC isn't useless - were it linux, you'd be typing a password every time. And as a non-administrator user, you DO type a password every time.

I just say that because I got sooooo annoyed by the fact that it would ask me for permission to open a program I JUST CLICKED ON. The way I see it, if I click on something, I want it to open and STFU.

Performance .... well, run it on the appropriate hardware and you'll have wonderful performance. I know I do. I don't have what would be considered a top-end beast anymore.

Right now, I'm working with a fairly new compy. Its about a year old now with a dual-core processor and 4GBs of ram. My computer takes ENTIRELY TOO LONG (5+ mins) to complete startup. I've already taken the necessary steps to decrease the startup times and up the performance, but I still come across problems with program crashes and lagging.

As for compatability, the reason for incompatability most of the time is that previously, the Windows system folder and Program Files system folder were whores - open to everyone. In Vista, they're prudes. Which is great from a security perspective. Unfortunately, software developers didn't want to change the way they've always done things, so things broke.

Which is something that should have been ironed out before they released Vista and forced people to buy it in the first place. When I was shopping for a new compy after my old one died, I wanted one that had XP on it, but with decent system specs which was rare, and I did not want to buy a computer with Vista, then buy the XP software.

That, unfortunately, is the name of the game in marketing. It's all one-up-manship and me-too-ism.

I know but damn, I'm just starting to learn the ins and outs with Vista. Now, I gotta know XP, Vista, and learn Vista 2!

[Linkmaster94]

So yeah...umm, don't know how strict moderating is here, but I happen to have a way to directly test things on Windows 7:razz:

So if anyone has any questions on it, I'd be more than happy to try my best to answer them.

[Majin GeoDooD]

I installed the Beta 1 (build 7000) leak today.. don't really know what the differences are over the earlier leak, but things work just fine on it as well. A buddy of mine actually uses the first leak as his permanent OS as of right now.

[Linkmaster94]

I installed the Beta 1 (build 7000) leak today.. don't really know what the differences are over the earlier leak, but things work just fine on it as well. A buddy of mine actually uses the first leak as his permanent OS as of right now.

Well, there ya go, cat's out of the bag now:razz:

Anyways, the 7000 build is rock solid from what I've used it for. Much much faster then Vista in terms of boot speed and responsiveness, and I know it sounds strange, but the locations of tools and their respective functions just makes sense now. Greatly looking forward to the final release.

[Sengin]

Hopefully they just won't charge an arm and a leg for it. Oh well, I can probably buy it much cheaper through my university (I should be in grad school at the time).

[prophetik music]

i'd get it on academic discount as well, i think.

yeah, 7000 is awesome. i've goofed around with it. really looking forward to release =)

[prophetik music]

i'm surprised no one's pointed this out, but the public beta starts tomorrow (the 9th). it's a free download, open to all - the first 2.5 million downloads get a key to allow them to use it past the 30-day deadline for registration that the beta has.

this is a different build than the 7000 beta available on bittorrent, and you should all get it. this is really looking good - it beat vista and xp on 21 of 23 real-world tests...by a LOT. it boots in 30 seconds =)

[Sengin]

If I had a spare/decent computer I would definitely try it out. For now though, I'll just have to rely on what others say.

[Kaden]

i'm surprised no one's pointed this out, but the public beta starts tomorrow (the 9th). it's a free download, open to all - the first 2.5 million downloads get a key to allow them to use it past the 30-day deadline for registration that the beta has.

this is a different build than the 7000 beta available on bittorrent, and you should all get it. this is really looking good - it beat vista and xp on 21 of 23 real-world tests...by a LOT. it boots in 30 seconds =)

what is the site for the beta? I'd love to get ahold of it to test with. I've got a spare PC to do it on.

[prophetik music]

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windows-7/default.aspx

it'll show up sometime tomorrow, but they won't say when. i think it'll be around 3am est (12 pst), but i can't be sure. weird timing, sure, but i still want it! i've had an extra partition sitting on my hard drive for testing various version of vista and w7 for over two years now.

[Kaden]

nice. Thanks for the reply and link.

[Gollgagh]

well hey, my birthday's tomorrow

I'll see if I can't sneak into the first 2.5 million downloads