OCR TF2: Stab stab stab!

[Native Jovian]

The proposed new engy item I think would work better as a sentry replacement than it would as a tele replacement. It's been mentioned by Valve that monkeying around with the tele or the dispenser tend to completely screw map balance, so I don't think replacing either of them is likely to happen. What the bear trap sounds like is an area denial weapon (similar to the sentry), so it seems like a fair trade. I can see two ways for it to work; like stickybombs (small area of effect, but can place more than one of them at once), or like a sentry (large area of effect, but only one at a time). Either way, I like the cloaking idea -- I'd say that they'd normally be completely cloaked to the enemy team, but they'd act like projectiles (so explosions, airblast, etc could knock them around), and they'd be visible (like a spy when he runs into someone) for a while after being moved.

Given that it would replace the sentry in this instance, I'd suggest making it another wrench replacement like the Gunslinger. Unfortunately, I can't really think of a good theme for a wrench to go with the trap (or with the set in general). Maybe a pair of wire cutters (like so)? Call it the Texas Hold 'Em and give it a description like "Useful for cutting free things you don't want to keep and putting down things you do". Of course, that would make more sense if it was a snare trap rather than a bear trap, but oh well...

[Cinderwild]

Something rusty with duct tape around the handle. Make it look like it came out of a country man's weather beaten toolshed.

[Top Gun]

The argument argument removing Dispensers is obvious, but I don't see the corresponding argument for Teleporters in the same light. Sure, there are larger maps where not having them utterly cripples your team's attack, but then there are others, including entire game modes, where teles do little to nothing. There's essentially no need for them on a KOTH or Arena map, and they're often largely useless on CTF. When you're defending the last point of a Payload or push-CP map, they won't do much good, since you're spawning right next to those points anyway. They're useful on 5-point CP, but if a point or two keep trading back and forth, an Engy can be hard-pressed to get them set up in the proper places quickly enough for them to make a difference. I'd say they're only truly indispensable on pure attack and while defending forward points. It'd be up to individual Engies in those situations to play smart and set their loadouts accordingly.

...not that your average random pub player is known for playing smart, but oh well.

[Powerlord]

The argument argument removing Dispensers is obvious, but I don't see the corresponding argument for Teleporters in the same light. Sure, there are larger maps where not having them utterly cripples your team's attack, but then there are others, including entire game modes, where teles do little to nothing. There's essentially no need for them on a KOTH or Arena map, and they're often largely useless on CTF. When you're defending the last point of a Payload or push-CP map, they won't do much good, since you're spawning right next to those points anyway. They're useful on 5-point CP, but if a point or two keep trading back and forth, an Engy can be hard-pressed to get them set up in the proper places quickly enough for them to make a difference. I'd say they're only truly indispensable on pure attack and while defending forward points. It'd be up to individual Engies in those situations to play smart and set their loadouts accordingly.

...not that your average random pub player is known for playing smart, but oh well.

Valve already said no to replacing either dispenser or teleporter.

[Kiyobi]

The thing is, if they give the players the ability to replace the teleporter, idiots will replace the teleporter. This includes, as Top Gun said, games on A/D maps. And people will be annoyed/pissed.

[Top Gun]

Valve already said no to replacing either dispenser or teleporter.

I know what they said, but that doesn't mean I agree with it.

[Aeronaut]

Valve already said no to replacing either dispenser or teleporter.

Before and since then, they've also seen fit to allow players to choose to:

• Remove all explosive weaponry from the "Demoman", leaving only a melee attack.
  
• Remove Overheal from the Medic.
  
• Use the Pain Train on CTF maps.
  
• Use the Jumper weapons.
  
• Suicide by console command at any time.
  
• Not build teleporters (or dispensers) at all in the first place.
  
• Play a class other than Engineer.
  

With the default loadout being the Teleporter, the Engineer can always choose to build them if the team needs it. Similarly, with the default Medigun having overheal and the default Demoman loadout having explosives, those classes can always be played to those strengths if need be.

Likewise, an Engineer can just as well already choose not to lay teleporters, which, in my opinion, is already a very frequent occurrence on smaller maps (usually KOTH).

While I understand Team Fortress 2 is a "team" game, nothing's stopping a team from, say, stacking snipers. Nothing's stopping a team from having no medics at all, and more relevantly, no Engineers at all.

If I can see a team with Demomen and Medics having neither Bombs nor Overheal (and consequently, no invincibility-granting Übercharge to boot), in other words, I don't see why we couldn't also just as well have a team with Engineers without teleporters.

...and yes, that's probably a bad mentality, but based on Valve's past additions to the game, I'd say it could very well happen. Not saying this is a good trend to follow (though I would personally approve of the bear traps), but it could happen.

[Bleck]

Overheal isn't really what makes the Medic important - the Quick-Fix might not be able to Overheal, but it does enable you to keep your entire team at full health consistently. And a Demoman without bombs isn't really a big deal, because he can still deal damage with well-placed crit-dashes, and other classes can still take out Sentries with the right tools and timing (in fact, Demomen are arguably no longer really needed to take out buildings because of the Cow Mangler).

Basically, you can't replace the Dispenser or Teleporter with another weapon for two reasons;

a) Anything that replaces a Dispenser or Teleporter needs to also be a supportive building, so that the Engineer does not lose his (arguably) primary functionality.

Another weapon that makes Engineers more powerful while also letting them shut down an area with a Sentry makes for too many powerful entities from one player.

[Brushfire]

I have internet again at my house.

Hail to the King Baby.

[bark]

I have internet again at my house.

Hail to the King Baby.

You're not the king, you're a doctor! of Horse hooves! you don't even have a P.HD in ass-kicking!

[Powerlord]

You're not the king, you're a doctor! of Horse hooves! you don't even have a P.HD in ass-kicking!

I thought he was a time traveling horse doctor.

In other news, my new desktop shipped today. Hopefully it'll be here by Friday, if not, it'll be until Monday.

Sadly, if it arrives on Friday, I won't be able to play Friday night due to installing software.

[Top Gun]

Likewise, an Engineer can just as well already choose not to lay teleporters, which, in my opinion, is already a very frequent occurrence on smaller maps (usually KOTH).

That's the crux of my argument too, and it's something that the Valve post doesn't address. The part pertaining to teleporters was written solely from the perspective of an attacking team on a payload/push map, which ignores the fact there are many situations where a teleporter does little to no good.

[Powerlord]

Circa 3 hours ago:

Required updates for Team Fortress 2 are now available. The specific changes include:

Source Engine Changes (CS:S, DoD:S, TF2, HL2:DM)

- Fix a crash bug during changelevel when the Steam client is unable to init

- Reduced the frequency of diagnostic messages for out-of-range positions and velocities

Team Fortress 2

- Added the Red Orchestra 2 promo items

- Fix a crash bug related to the Righteous Bison

- Fix a bug where the increased_maxplayers server tag was being set when the 25th internal player slot was added for replay

- Fixed a bug that caused team color paints to appear to be coming out of the wrong cans for the store icons

- Updated the main menu backgrounds to include Granary and Upward

Servers auto-updated and restarted around the same time (this auto-update then restart is really neat).

[Sir Prize]

Man, I didn't expect so much... strong division here over the Bear Trap replacing the Teleporter. XD

If it helps, I'm trying to make sure that the building, along with the gun that goes alongside it, are SIDEGRADES. I want to avoid people taking the shottie on the grounds of "it's a better gun than the normal shotgun"... and I don't want people taking the bear trap because it's hands-down better than the teleporter. I think that's why I keep pressing so hard for criticism and comments on it (along with doing

)... so I'm making sure I'm not making an item that outshines the teleporter. Instead, I just want it to be an option in situations where a teleporter just isn't that handy.

I don't think I could ever think of something that could feasibly replace the Dispenser, though. It's just too handy to have, both for the Engineer and for his team. On ANY map.

[Secret Agent Man]

I don't think you should let Valve's quote-unquote "official" stance hold you back on submitting your items. They stopped caring about things like balance, theme, and items that actually make sense a long time ago.

[Cinderwild]

So I've asked about this on the official forums but nothing has helped so far. Recently after re-installing the game I've been having this issue where my drop rate seems to drop to about 10 for a brief few seconds. It seems to happen a lot when I move my point of view around a bunch.

Thread on the forum: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2026258

[Sir Prize]

I don't think you should let Valve's quote-unquote "official" stance hold you back on submitting your items. They stopped caring about things like balance, theme, and items that actually make sense a long time ago.

Well, even if they decided to stop caring about balance and such... doesn't mean I should just submit something willynilly. Not only for the sake of balance and theme, but so that people on both sides of the weapon at hand feel like the weapon is a valid option.

[Powerlord]

Required updates for Team Fortress 2 are now available. The specific changes include:

Source Engine Changes (CS:S, DoD:S, TF2, HL2:DM)

- Added a check to prevent kicking Replay and SourceTV clients from servers

Team Fortress 2

- Added new items for upcoming promotions

- Fixed a case where health overheal wasn't being applied when multiple healers were involved

- Fixed the new Gravelpit backgrounds using the wrong filename

- Updated the Mask of the Shaman

- Updated the localization files

It should be applied to our servers shortly.

Edit: It looks like there are alternative version of Engineer buildings in this update, with the name Pipboy. Pipboy being the name of the mascot for the Fallout series.

Edit 2: The items in question are for Skyrim.

Edit 3: There may be a Brink item as well, I can't tell.

[Secret Agent Man]

Well, even if they decided to stop caring about balance and such... doesn't mean I should just submit something willynilly. Not only for the sake of balance and theme, but so that people on both sides of the weapon at hand feel like the weapon is a valid option.

That's perfectly fair. I'm just saying that you shouldn't worry about Valve's official stance on anything regarding this game, i.e. let that be a reason for holding you back.

[Brushfire]

Edit 2: The items in question are for Skyrim.

I demand photos!

[Dyne]

TF2 just updated for me, but I'm unable to get on any server at all. Not sure what the deal is. Ideas?

[Powerlord]

TF2 just updated for me, but I'm unable to get on any server at all. Not sure what the deal is. Ideas?

Our servers aren't coming back up post update. I need to see what's going on in more depth.

It appears that the server binary is gone or moved. I'm looking into it now.

Edit: Servers are now back up. Thanks Valve for the update missing half the files and forcing me to do a file verification on the server.

[One-Hit]

Skyrim

[Powerlord]

The new items are:

1. A new Rocket Launcher named "The Original." Likely a reskin of the regular rocket launcher, as it has no description.
   
2. A new Sniper hat named "The Anger" that looks a lot like the Conjurer's Cowl. Brink-related.
   
3. A new Heavy hat named "The Tamrailic Relic" which looks a lot like the Spine-Chilling Skull. Skyrim-related.
   
4. An new Engineer Misc named "The Pip-Boy", which replaces the Engineer PDAs (not buildings, whoops)
   
5. An new Engineer Misc named "Wingstick".
   

[Dyne]

Also, the new server is laggy as hell. But you knew that already.