OCR01273 - Terranigma "Reviving Zue"

[djpretzel]

What did you think? Post your opinion of this ReMix.

[Claado Shou]

Ziwtra pwns again.

[Rex]

I don't know if you're genuinely curious, djp, but the goal of part of Terranigma is to revive the planet. Zue is one of the dungeons, the one in which you revive mammals.

Great song, by the way. ;

[PianoMan]

I just love it when orchestral and other genres mix...always a ride that I love, from beginning to end. This is no exception. I just love that guitar at 58'...Good Job, total pwnage.

[Sam Ascher-Weiss]

I have to ask something. Why did you pick Zue? There is plenty to like in your ReMix but I don't understand why you chose Zue.

If you look in my profile you'll notice that I listed Miyoko Kobayashi as one of my Interests. She is probably my FAVORITE VGM composer. [or very close]

I used to be obsessed with zue. It is rhythmically ingenius. It is 3 bars of 7 then one bar of 6. [that's the main sections] than there are 2 sections in six. The coolest thing is the way in which the sections are juxtaposed makes the 6's sound like odd time signatures.

Also in the original check out the the 7/4 bassline and how it switches back and forth to 6/4. The drums are also playing a VERY original 7/4 clave that I never heard of and that BRILLIANT organ line that really spells out the rhythm construction.

Zue [the original] has very little to offer in the melodic department [though the melody is phrased in a really cool manner]. It just basically hovers around ab minor but I think this was intentional on Miyoko's part since Zue was intented as a rhythmic composition. [she's capable of writing very complex harmonic stuff].

I actually Like your ReMix but I wrote all this because of the comment you made in your submission E-mail:

"The original is in 6/4 or 7/4 or some weird time signature and it took a lot of manhandling of the material to get it into the 4/4 breakbeat form it's in now"

The Whole point of Zue WERE the rhythmic constructions so if you go out of your way to throw those out.... basically nothing is left in the song so WHY ON EARTH DID YOU CHOSE ZUE?? One of my all time favorite songs. Please answer me.

PS: I actually liked you ReMix quite a bit [once I look past your choice of source tune]

[big giant circles]

wow. I downloaded this when it was in the WIP forum.

This is a different mix from the last one you put up in there, is it not? The mixing/mastering is much better. The drums are toned down, the bass is cranked up a little (good thing).

I've had this burned on a CD and I'd been digging it on my way to work many a-times over the last couple months. Ah, so that's a guitar, is it? I always thought it was some sort of funktified cross between a tenor sax and a synth bass. Whatever it is, I highly enjoy it.

This is also shorter than the one I downloaded. Oh well. I appreciate your humility, as it is apparant that the standards you set make it obvious that you aren't going to waste you time creating something that wasn't some sort of challenge, nor submit something unless it is close to the very best you could possibly do. That shows integrity, especially as a musician. I think that's about as high a compliment as someone could receive.

Great work

Edited March 26, 2009 by big giant circles

[StarSoldier]

I wish there were more Terranigma remixes. It was a great game, albeit kinda ignored. I love Ziwtra's material.

I have to agree with Shnabubula. This particular remix, you don't really capture the feeling of Zue. It's so hidden and the allure of the original musical piece were the drums, that crazy rhythm. They added to the mood. While this piece is wonderful on its own, it's just not the Zue you encounter in the game.

Perhaps you could do another mix of this like you did for Blue and really funkify it using the crazy time signature? ^^

[YuPing]

yay! my post from months back (which is gone from the forums) has been answered! Whether or not this remix was a response to my request for more Terranigma songs, and, specifically, a Zue remix, I'm quite happy. it is odd to hear it in such a different form, but hey, the more good terranigma mixes the better.

[DJ Riott]

An interesting mix right from the beginning. Unique drum patterns and scratch samples.

- Lead synth/instrument really catches me and its awkward notes sound very fitting actually.

Everything is solid, and the song doesn't lose energy throughout the entire piece. Breakbeat stylings and flowing harmonics amount to an enjoyable song. Good work.

[woekitten]

Yes, we need far more Terranigma remixes. The game had some brilliant music.

This is a good one. Zue (or was it Zuu) had an interesting sound. I don't know if Pretzel is reading this, but the point of Terranigma is to revive civilisation (the game is a prequel to Illusion of Gaia). Zue isn't a person or thing, but a place that needed to be "awakened", like the rest of the world. I think, in the game, it represented Africa. I could be wrong, it's been a while since I last played.

[StarSoldier]

Yeah, Zue is approximately Africa. That's where you land when the seagulls take you there. Terranigma is a great game, but it's one of those that after you beat it, you really don't feel like playing it again because of all the puzzles in the game. Very enjoyable, though.

And, of course, the music is great. Probably playing with the themes of the characters, such as Perel, Royd, and Fyda would be fun, some medley of those guys. They could be considered apostles or saints of the god (if you remember Yumi's statement at the end) and deserve some credit of their own.

[Souliarc]

Great song, it's seems to keep your blood flowing with the beat and guitar, yet settles you with the flute and violin. The general electronica feel from Ziwtra always is pleasing to the ears. I can't vouge for the original "Zue" song, but this one stands alone easily. I can only aspire to creating something like this, and eventually, I will, with these types of songs in mind.

[Smoke]

Yes, we need far more Terranigma remixes. The game had some brilliant music.

This is a good one. Zue (or was it Zuu) had an interesting sound. I don't know if Pretzel is reading this, but the point of Terranigma is to revive civilisation (the game is a prequel to Illusion of Gaia). Zue isn't a person or thing, but a place that needed to be "awakened", like the rest of the world. I think, in the game, it represented Africa. I could be wrong, it's been a while since I last played.

Soulblazer, Illusion of Gaia/Time(Soulblazer 2) and Terranigma (Illusion of Gaia 2/Soulblazer 3) are actually all 3 part of the "soul" series, and aren't related outside of similar themes involving the resurrection of the world, as well as the souls and the ability to talk to plants and animals, along with some other stuff(Following the orders of a God during the game). Terranigma's the best of the three, but it was never released in the US because Enix closed their US office shortly before its release.

Anyways, I like this. It's got a good beat going, and is very different from the original Zue theme. It's on my iPod Mini now.

[Kaizou]

Always liked Ziwtra's mixes, but this is extra sweet being a remix of a song that one catch motif that was something like 5 seconds long and had 10 notes or something (--- refer to Shnabubula's post above... that's what I'm trying to talk about ), that just kept repeating... but kicked ass nonetheless just cuzza its great feel. Ziwtra turns the vigorous jungle motif and beat into a smooth jazzy-techno thing that makes the song sound dreamy-organic like, as if the protagonist, having completed his charge, is reflecting back on the experience of reviving Zue. Unique take on the mix that both deviates (with the guitar like interlude) and remains true to the emotive focus (everywhere else) of the original. Props.

[Corporal Eschebone]

Hm... The intro sounds a lot like Kai Tracid's "Life Is Too Short" [Energy Mix to be specific].

Pretty nice all around. This is breakbeat or something close to it, right?... Or if it isn't, the percussion makes it seem like it'd be that.

I like them string instruments. Electronic and [possibly fake] acoustic go really well together when done right.

[Brim]

Great stuff here, thoroughly enjoyed the sheer awesome of the song. Everything composed in such a great manner. What a great blend of airy, soft instruments and, for lack of better words, harder, grittier instruments.

[A-RoN]

One word to describe it:

TIGHT!

The percussion and bassline is top notch. The bassline is so catchy that it took me 50 or more listens before I got bored with the intro.

Even though the instrumentation wasn't as enjoyable as FFA Willed Assault, this mix still has great flute-work. The turn-tablistic gating, reversing, and pull-backs are unatural but awesome!

Ladies and gentlemen, if you know anyone that thinks techno, dance, or electronica's all just repetitive stuff, then let them listen to any track Ziwtra puts out and put that opinion to shame!

Excellent !

9.7/10 (-.3 as the instrumental was good but not ear catching).

[jordex]

Damn this is crazy!

Those scratches are ass-kicking!

Nice bassline too

The mix of classical instruments with the groovy drums are just plain sweet

Overall this songs groovy, great to kick back too

[krale]

----"The original is in 6/4 or 7/4 or some weird time signature and it took a lot of manhandling of the material to get it into the 4/4 breakbeat form it's in now. Other than that... this isn't a personal favorite, but I really do like that flute at the beginning. And the weird guitar sound. I guess I am not so happy with this mix because I used so many gimmicks that I have used in the past... other than the musical challenge of changing time signatures and adapting the song, I felt I didn't break any new ground or improve in any way. Oh well."

Erm, the song is in 3. 6 would be a multiple of 3, and would allow you to 'do it in 2' with some difficulty. The melody is obviously at first subdivided into 9 measure phrases in which later changes.

DOnt get me wrong, bt the song is cool, but it's not "some weird time signature". If you want a really good example of a "weird T/S", go look at Final Fantasy 6 "Another World of Beasts". fun 7/8 time signature to play with.

It could be worse.. I played for a marching band a song with 4/4, 3/4, 5/8, 7/8 in it. It was by Richard Melilo and the name of the piece was "Timestorm". That was a beautiful number Just picture marching in a fast 4 whilst playing 5/8 and 7/8 stuff. ;P

[Sam Ascher-Weiss]

Edit 3:

Okay now I'm sort of lost. Why are you insulting my composing? You might be a genius musician Krale. Seriously you could be a brilliant composer/performer.... I'm not saying any thing about that. I'm just saying you're confused about the issue of time signature.

The reason I'm arguing about that is because I want people to apreciate what a master piece Zue [the original] is and you are down playing it.

As for my performing experience/composing/schooling I have sent you a private message concerning it since I don't think that belongs in the forum [and it does not help prove my point about ZUE]

I'm just fanatical about Miyoko Kobayashi and I hate to see her misrepresented.

PS: Who is Chopan.... I have never heard of this person. Is he at all connected to the polish composer Chopin??? Ok that was too far... but I couldn't help myself.

PPS: I was using the slang term ritarded meaning mentally handicapped. I was basically saying it would sound stupid. I was not talking about slowing the tempo

[krale]

You are gravely mistaken my friend. Read my first post

Explain to me why Im "gravely mistaken".

The song is obviously in 3, no matter if the baseline is in a faux-7 and 6. The first 2 phrases of this song are in 27 beats (or 9 measures of 3) if you do not count the leading 3 beats.

[sadpickle the exalted]

You are gravely mistaken my friend. Read my first post

Explain to me why Im "gravely mistaken".

The song is obviously in 3, no matter if the baseline is in a faux-7 and 6. The first 2 phrases of this song are in 27 beats (or 9 measures of 3) if you do not count the leading 3 beats.

It's in 4/4, which is pretty easy to hear right from getgo. Chant it quickly. "onetwothreefouronetwothreefour". What are we arguing about here?

[krale]

----"The original is in 6/4 or 7/4 or some weird time signature and it took a lot of manhandling of the material to get it into the 4/4 breakbeat form it's in now. Other than that... this isn't a personal favorite, but I really do like that flute at the beginning. And the weird guitar sound. I guess I am not so happy with this mix because I used so many gimmicks that I have used in the past... other than the musical challenge of changing time signatures and adapting the song, I felt I didn't break any new ground or improve in any way. Oh well."

Erm, the song is in 3. 6 would be a multiple of 3, and would allow you to 'do it in 2' with some difficulty. The melody is obviously at first subdivided into 9 measure phrases in which later changes.

DOnt get me wrong, bt the song is cool, but it's not "some weird time signature". If you want a really good example of a "weird T/S", go look at Final Fantasy 6 "Another World of Beasts". fun 7/8 time signature to play with.

It could be worse.. I played for a marching band a song with 4/4, 3/4, 5/8, 7/8 in it. It was by Richard Melilo and the name of the piece was "Timestorm". That was a beautiful number Just picture marching in a fast 4 whilst playing 5/8 and 7/8 stuff. ;P

You are gravely mistaken my friend. Read my first post

EDIT: This is in response to what's written below.

Please say you're joking. So you're telling me that to determine the time signature.... you add up the total number of beats in a section and then see which small numbers go into it evenly? That makes no sense.... Do that for rite of spring and maybe it's in 4/4 for all we know.

Gravely mistaken? Really?

Has it ever occured to you that if you attempt to transcribe a work, you must attack a time signature to it?

There is no exact signature to attach to every work, as you could easily use factors to change it (say, a fast 4/4 to a medium 2/2). Unlike what you seem to say, you CAN atempt a profile of a song by

1: Counting lead beats for getting a rough beats per minute.

2: 'Feeling how long a phrase is'.

This reminds me of when someone made the outrageous claim that "hey ya" was in eleven.... since it is 3 Bars of 4/4 one bar of 2/4 and then 2 bars of 4/4. In total that makes 22 Quarter notes.... 22 is a multiple of 11 therefore it must be 11!! I honestly saw someone make this claim

And yet you assume that I am the same. I am not.

Take a look at a Bartok Score. You'll notice that the time signature varies almost like every bar. This is because time signatures are used to show the listener/performers where one is supposed to be.

Yeah. Bartok. From the same craptacular lines of Chopan and their ilk. I hate having to count 120 bars for my parts to come in. On the opposing side, playing Gershwin pieces, like Rhapsody in Blue are fun.

And BTW, I've even had directors 'shit their pants' on stage over how the pianist plays these non-time signature songs. Of course, I bet you have no real concert practice, eh?

In Zue the location of one [first downbeat] is constantly varying[not just in the bassline but in the drums and organ as well] that means the time signature is adjusting.

Im talking about the source material, the SPC ripped from the game via zsnes sound extract. I then can import it via a tool to a Impulse Tracker and open it in ModPlug Tracker. After doing that, the base beats Im looking at channel 2 and 8. Channel 8 has subdivided notes (at 2x speed of the first 3 beats).

By your logic 7+7+7+6+7+7+7+6+6+6+7+7+7+6+7+7+7+6+6+6+6+6+6 = 144

So that means Zue could be 48 bars of 3

36 bars of 4, or 12 bars of 12.... Do you understand why this line of reasoning makes absolutely no sense?

I do, but evidently, you do not. In reality, depending what you play, 2, 3, 4, and 6 are all compatible. 2, 3, and 6 could all be used in a valse like Valse de Fleurs (Nutcracker). Just this last winter, I played that very solo. The song under our director, was conducted in a slow-ish 1, but my score is in 3. That specific solo is rolling upwards eighths, so counting 6 is possible.

A question to you would be the following: What is the proper time signature for a song that is in 3/4, and has an excess of dotted quarters?

I beg you to listen very carefully to Zue and while you do so Try counting 1,2,3 over and over during the whole song.... see how ritarded that sounds.. and then get back to me. Ocassionally you will come out at the right place but for the most part it will sound wrong.

I did it, and the rythym does not ritard, but I've to question who exactly that 'ritard' is.

I would really like to know what experience you have in transcribing and composing. And no, I do not mean djng or other new-age crap. I mean real music work.

I find it hillarious that the song you spoke of is called Timestorm when it deals with such laughably simple time signatures.

Are you some sort of idiot? SO, according to you, every 4/4 time signature song is childs play? Well, I guess it is to you, if you create audio excrement.

I admit I come off a bit arrogant in my above statements but they are true none the less.

True, hardly. Places that deal in audio have this 'golden ear' syndrome. Whether people argue about types of wiring (gold vs copper vs material of the day) or headsets, or speakers, or whatever, it always is the "Im always right, youre always wrong" mentality. Perhaps, you might try backing up with your proof, and not try to divert attention on piano concertos.

Edit Number 2 in response to Sad pickle.

Ok now we've just about entered the twilight zone as far as I can tell. YOU'RE COUNTING SUBDIVISIONS!!!!!!

If you count in 16th notes then there will always be four of them for every beat. EVERY SONG EVER WRITTEN [as long as it's not swing-time] can be counted one-two-three-four because individual beats can always be subdivided into four [unless it's swing]This has absolutely nothing to do with time-signatures. Okay thank you!

What do you think "beats" are? Oh yeah, they dont subdivide anything, right? Guess what, without subdividing, you'd end up with every song in 1 and that 1 would be the length of the song. Yeah, that sounds silly, but that'd be the truth.

[Rexy]

I've been familiar with a fair chunk of Ziwtra's work in the past, and even here I'm impressed with this mix. I can't say I'm too hot on Terranigma but it's cool to see some expansive coverage for the game score outside the countless Crysta mixes it has mainly spawned.

So yeah, it's about time I managed to catch onto a light write-up through listening to the mix, using the same analysis stylesheet that I adapted to as a Sonic Revolution judge.

Remix

This piece has its light familiarities to the source in terms of some of the melodic progressions to it, although I was hoping for a little bit more; nonetheless it's still got its progressive appeal upon much of the alterations taken to it. The time signature conversion was very good along with much of the liberalities that were taken on with some of the portions of the theme to help create a very thoughtful atmosphere to easily round off that aspect of the track. In terms of execution I managed to appreciate a good amount of this for what it was; much of it was very clean and well rounded to be able to take in all the way through, even for a song of this genre. The structuring was also good with the breaking down of the melodic aspects as well as much of the connections with other components of the arrangement; was hoping a bit more out of the whole verse-chorus pattern but this is still very well thought out especially with much of the breaks that came in-between. In terms of standing alone it works well if you want a good groove to go into; may not fit everyone's tastes depending on genre passion but it has still got some very firm material granted around it through its establishments alone. In all honesty this is one of the more liberal incarnations out of the mixes I've witnessed from Ziwtra, but it was well crafted to keep things interesting nonetheless.

Creativity

I managed to detect a lot of fresh areas after the second permutation of the theme (2:36) and it's there that I appreciated a lot of the thought that came through with much of the progressions at hand. Even here the melody's been played around a fair amount and with a firm and lively atmosphere to maintain the audience's interest. For much of the time the segments link together rather well for what they were, especially for a track like this; although I was hoping for some of the later portions to end up with a more dynamic emphasis a la what was shown in "Rain in Chicago". I can tell that much of its pulse has done well to adapt well to those who want something with a groove to listen to, so for some it can be fresh on that aspects. Some of the melodic sections could moderately tire out especially with some of the main riff as shown upon the flute throughout the mix, but that's alright. There's not much repetition so to speak of, although if anything I'd point at the bass; could do with some variance in rhythm in parts to make that stick out a bit more, although it still felt rather thoughtful in keeping the pulse intact. As a whole I can say it's enjoyable if you're into the genre, although even if you're not it’s still be worth a shot and you may even get a kick out of it if you've played the game.

Production

The samples are generally alright in their execution; a bit trebly in some parts but they're still well chosen. I weren't too down with some of the orchestrated elements most notably the violin that came in later, and I wasn't too sure about the choice of bass for what it was, although I really appreciate much of the synth pad and lead patches for what they were. Going back to the treble-like EQs it would help to space them out a fair amount, with an increase in low-end frequencies granted to sounds like the bass (obviously), some mid-frequencies towards some of the mid-range spectrum and further attention to instruments like the flute and violin to make them sound a bit crisper if required. The overall encoding was very sharp for what it was; I found much of the drum sampling (given that it sounded the same almost all the way through) to be very strong in its own right to help emphasize on the track quality. The sound levels are very loud and brash; not quite the most dynamic that the user may adapt to but they've still got their moments to be able to match up to on that field. The panning is shown to be a bit dependant on the right hand speaker so it should help to have just as much going on at the other side; mind you as a whole I saw a fair amount of action right across the instrumentation, instantly defining them for what they were. In terms of the technical aspect I can't see this as one of Ziwtra's better works but it's definitely slick enough for what it was and should be worth noting interest.

Having looked back at the judges decisions I feel that much of my qualms relating to the track are similar to Liontamer's on the quirk on that I've heard some much better production work from Ziwtra. But even with that into mind the overall arrangement, although a little bit over-liberal in parts, was still very cool and expansive for even source material like this one.

So yeah, it's not the hottest of Ziwtra works the site has on offer but it's still a goodie if you want to see some slick quality Terranigma coverage. It was worthy of my time and it can be of yours too if you're a fan of the game/genre/musician. Hope to see more work from this user in the future!

[Culturekoi]

I've had this song for a while, and I've always liked it quite a bit. After a few months of not hearing it once, I just turned the song on repeat and plugged in my good speakers for a few minutes. Great song! The flute (or whatever instrument that is, I haven't a clue) at 0:30 to about 1:00 sounds fantastic, I really like how you switched up the main instrument throughout the song. I also dig the shift between higher-energy to kind of elegant-sounding and then back at about 2 minutes.

Good stuff.