Ideas on remixing shorter songs?

[Doombeard]

Hey there, long time lurker, first time poster!

Been playing music for quite some time, avid gamer and decided to try my hand on remixing. Started out with a short piece (main melody is 30-45 seconds) and I've added some newly created melodies, but find myself a bit stuck. Considered bringing in another song to the remix to allow for fleshing out of the piece, but any other ideas? How d'ya guys usually approach remixing a shorter piece to keep it a remix and not add -too- much new, but still making it fresh?

Thanks for your time!

[ad.mixx]

You can do so much with music dude. Original solos, varying chords, changes to melody, drum arrangement, heck even just adding some atmosphere can do so much for an overall arrangement. Ive passed a 4 minute remix of a six second source on ocremix. Its not as hard as it sounds.

Just be creative, i wouldnt worry about it sounding too different honestly. As long as the melody is recognizable, just do what sounds good to you. Its your arrangement after all.

[Rozovian]

I remixed Space Invaders. Source has four notes, it's the only source I used, and there's no part of the mix that doesn't use those four notes one way or another.

You should never add another source just for length, imo. If you use multiple sources, they should complement each other in some way. A single source can be rewritten with new chords, new mode, new uses of snippets of melodies, and original content can be written with references to source. There's a lot that can be done with a single melody, and most music has more than just a single melody - they've got backing, rhythms, chords...

If you want a challenge, grab some really short and simple melody, like the SMB underground or something, see how many different takes on it you can do. Give it 15-30 minutes just to screw with it, see what you come up with. You should end up with a handful of different directions to go with it, and some of those might work together. Once you know how to do that, do the same with whatever parts of your 30-45 sec source, and see what you can do with those.

[Skolar]

I remixed Space Invaders. Source has four notes, it's the only source I used, and there's no part of the mix that doesn't use those four notes one way or another.

You should never add another source just for length, imo. If you use multiple sources, they should complement each other in some way. A single source can be rewritten with new chords, new mode, new uses of snippets of melodies, and original content can be written with references to source. There's a lot that can be done with a single melody, and most music has more than just a single melody - they've got backing, rhythms, chords...

If you want a challenge, grab some really short and simple melody, like the SMB underground or something, see how many different takes on it you can do. Give it 15-30 minutes just to screw with it, see what you come up with. You should end up with a handful of different directions to go with it, and some of those might work together. Once you know how to do that, do the same with whatever parts of your 30-45 sec source, and see what you can do with those.

This rings true with the way I've been trying to approach stuff lately. Very inspirational advice!

[Nabeel Ansari]

Add embellishments and chord changes.

For example, if there is some sort of arpeggiated chord progression, make a new arpeggio that follows the same melodic pattern but to different chords.

It's the source material, but give you way more material to work with.

[Doombeard]

I remixed Space Invaders. Source has four notes, it's the only source I used, and there's no part of the mix that doesn't use those four notes one way or another.

You should never add another source just for length, imo. If you use multiple sources, they should complement each other in some way. A single source can be rewritten with new chords, new mode, new uses of snippets of melodies, and original content can be written with references to source. There's a lot that can be done with a single melody, and most music has more than just a single melody - they've got backing, rhythms, chords...

If you want a challenge, grab some really short and simple melody, like the SMB underground or something, see how many different takes on it you can do. Give it 15-30 minutes just to screw with it, see what you come up with. You should end up with a handful of different directions to go with it, and some of those might work together. Once you know how to do that, do the same with whatever parts of your 30-45 sec source, and see what you can do with those.

Wow man, listening to that piece is pretty damn inspiring. Good trick, I'll definitely try that, maybe I've just gotten too "stuck" on this one set style. And thanks to all you other dudes/dudettes, got some ideas balling around now.

[timaeus222]

I definitely would echo the idea of changing the chords around. I need to try lengthening a chord progression sometime and adding my own chords in between. That would probably give me some good ideas, and probably you too.

[AngelCityOutlaw]

Yeah, but just make sure that the chord changes actually harmonize in some intelligent way with the melody. Remember, the chords beneath the melody in the original song were chosen for a reason.

[quintin3265]

Hey Doombeard,

In my opinion, the best game remix album created from short source material is called "Jingle All The Way," by the Bad Dudes.

This Christmas album consists entirely of "jingles" - or songs like the "game over" theme. Unfortunately, I just looked and the album online appears to have had its tracklist changed without comment from the tracks I originally downloaded. The new tracks, in my opinion, are not as amazing as the originals. Here are three of the original tracks that deserve special praise that I managed to find publicly posted:

"Strange Island Eggplant" - http://baddudes.bandcamp.com/track/zyko-strange-island-eggplant-adventure-island-ii

"Lucca" - http://baddudes.bandcamp.com/track/danimal-cannon-lucca-chrono-trigger

"You Gon' Get Whipped" - http://ocremix.org/remix/OCR02073/

To appreciate what these guys did, you have to consider that the originals were often ten seconds long. Myself, I could not begin to approach anything of the sort.

Having a collection of 5000 songs on my computer, I believe that "Strange Island Eggplant" is perhaps the best video game remix of all time. As these three songs demonstrate, one way to approach short songs is to tell a story. A significant part of "Strange Island Eggplant" consists of a relatively simple drumbeat with the crazed narrator mumbling about his battle against the eggplant, but because the listener is engaged in the humorous "story," it is not necessary to create a fancy melody as would be required for a remix of "Dancing Mad," for example.

Short songs that succeed as remixes do so because they tell stories. You can tell a story with the notes, with effects, with vocals, or with a combination of all three. If you simply repeat the melody and add a few notes or different instruments, the song will get old quick. If, on the other hand, you create a narrative and then use the jingle as the background for that narrative, you'll have a hit on your hands.

[OneUp]

When I'm trying to make a remix, the first thing I choose is a genre and then try to recreate the sound of (the popular songs in) the genre as close as I can. The main melody of the source is often still used as the main melody of the remix and then you add the complementary genre specific elements to the remix. Don't be afraid to copy popular songs, people will probably not even notice it since you'll be using different chords and instruments.

[SonicThHedgog]

I tend to use my imagination, it works wonders, and I think more people need to start using it too... at least once in a while

[Nabeel Ansari]

I tend to use my imagination, it works wonders, and I think more people need to start using it too... at least once in a while

This is the most unhelpful snide piece of advice I've seen in quite a long time.

[AngelCityOutlaw]

This is the most unhelpful snide piece of advice I've seen in quite a long time.

This is not the first time he has said that either.

[Skyline Drop]

One quick way you can expand on a shorter source is by first breaking it down to smaller fragments (A section, B section, etc.) and then repeating them with slight variations.

For instance, say the source is only about 30 seconds long, and you can split it into 3 distinct musical "ideas" each about ten seconds long, so it has the original structure ABC. You could take the easy way out and just double the length of each section by repeating it: AABBCC. Now you have 60 seconds of music, but it's kind of repetitive and maybe a bit jarring with transitions. So you choose to develop the idea a little bit differently with each repetition. Now you have AA'BB'CC'. Still 60 seconds long, but a little bit easier on the ears, and it doesn't require too terribly much added composition on your end.

You can add a little bit more development by introducing the A section with a little intro, maybe like 20 or so seconds long, and then add a variation of that to the end, so now you have IAA'BB'CC'I'. The original source is still the primary focus, but now you've got over three times as much music in your arrangement - and that's without visiting any part of the source more than twice.

If I were going about it, I'd probably take something more like this:

IAA'AA''BB'BB''AA'A''CC'CC''AA'AA''I'

That arrangement requires at least two developments on each section of the theme, but also makes it considerably longer and more firmly focuses the arrangement on one central melodic idea, which can help to give it a bit more direction.

[SonicThHedgog]

This is the most unhelpful snide piece of advice I've seen in quite a long time.

Explain please : D

This is not the first time he has said that either.

I say it alot

[AngelCityOutlaw]

Explain please : D

I say it alot

Because it is a smart-ass comment that does not help the OP.

[SonicThHedgog]

Because it is a smart-ass comment that does not help the OP.

Its not a smart ass comment, I was dead serious.

Edit: just want to note, if anyone feels like it was unhelpful, then simply ignore it.

[Rozovian]

"I tend to use notes, unlike SOME PEOPLE".

So yeah, please be a little more helpful, eg by being specific as to how you're actually using your imagination in remixing shorter songs. If you don't have anything useful to contribute, don't contribute.

[SonicThHedgog]

"I tend to use notes, unlike SOME PEOPLE".

So yeah, please be a little more helpful, eg by being specific as to how you're actually using your imagination in remixing shorter songs. If you don't have anything useful to contribute, don't contribute.

Now this post I like!

yes next time I will (try) to elaborate on using imagination!

[Nase]

Tangential, but the title got me thinking...

Will there ever be a classic 1 minute punk rock song on OCR?

I can remember a sonic remix by Jaxx (sp?) that was really two 1 minute mixes. Worked as a workaround, I guess.

And possibly shael's groin. That is kinda punk.

I generally agree that 3 minutes is a good amount for a short song, but there are soo many notable exceptions once you start looking through your LPs.

Or vgm database.

[SnappleMan]

1. Take original song, cover it, make sure you repeat it at least twice in the arrangement.

2. Stretch original song by 500-1000%.

3. Stretched out version is now a lengthy chord progression.

4. Build on new chord progression at full tempo (meaning if your original tempo was 150bpm and you stretched it out to the equivalent of 10bpm, write 150bpm music over the 10bpm progression)

5. When writing consider the rhythmic and harmonic properties of the original, so no matter what you write it'll feel like it belongs in the song.

That's just one trick, usually it's easy enough to just write randomly in the same key and get away with it. Once you get some experience under your belt it becomes pretty easy to take a 30 second song and arrange it to 6-8 minutes, but don't expect it to be totally tasteful or musically meaningful.

[Rozovian]

2. Stretch original song by 500-1000%.

...

That's just one trick...

Speaking of stretching, here's another trick.

[CC Ricers]

Snappleman has a nice idea. Use a big version of the source, and then compound the source in smaller versions sprinkled throughout the track, flip it around, transform it in different ways etc. to the point where you now have more differences and variations making the sum bigger than its parts.

Well,

has nothing to do with music but it explains the idea better in a visual way.

[timaeus222]

Speaking of stretching, here's another trick.

Yeah, I have that program. I never did use it all that much, mostly because I don't actually have any sound I think might sound good at 800%. xD

[Skyline Drop]

Tangential, but the title got me thinking...

Will there ever be a classic 1 minute punk rock song on OCR?

I don't think OCRemix has an explicit lower bound in regards to song length, but given that expansion on a given theme is a really big criterion for submissions, I doubt it'll go through.

And possibly shael's groin. That is kinda punk.

I'm still amazed that that song is still up. I guess djp has a nostalgic sense of humor.