Xbox One

[Calpis]

to my point: it's pretty irrelevant if they're still losing money selling them... especially if people are buying them and not using them for games. then the only feasible source of revenue, licensing costs and royalties, are gone.

Don't worry. The amount of ads on your dash will make up for that.

[Cerrax]

I don't think putting all these extra features in really hurts the Xbox One. When I was growing up, my parents did not like the idea of buying a machine that only plays video games. The only reason they bought me an SNES is to bribe me into passing second grade. If the SNES could have played movies, or music, or do anything besides play games, it might have been an easier pill for my parents to swallow. Hell, my mother to this day loves PlayStation because PS2 has a DVD drive and PS3 has a Blu-Ray drive. And let's not forget both of those non-gaming technologies have pushed games to new limits. Games were never stored on DVDs until PS2 came out, and games weren't on Blu-Ray until PS3. This has allowed games with more content, more detail, and better quality graphics and sound.

Skyrim is 4.6 GB. That would have taken over 7 CD-ROMs (the storage format of pre-PS2 games), which would have to be stored on a hard drive because Skyrim is a non-linear game. Thanks to DVD technology, Skyrim can be played without installation from a single disc on an Xbox 360.

Edited June 5, 2013 by Cerrax

[Gario]

You know?

Xbox One could probably get a great audience and succeed if it went balls out and just went 100% digital download. I know some people don't have internet speeds to justify it, but it's actually reasonable to market to that group, considering it needs to be online to work, anyway (at least once a day). Digital only would give enough convenience and justification to closing the used market (considering it would be impossible to trade, anyway). Forcing a disk download AND requiring internet verification, downloading the game to the system, etc, it just doesn't make sense - go one way or the other, but not in between.

[Crowbar Man]

Gario: Aren't games going to be available digitally same day as the release this time around, just like PS4? It really is pretty much a digital only system, the discs are just for convenience of not having to download possibly gigantic games.

But heres the kicker: There are plenty of digital only devices out there (iOS, Android, Windows Phone, popular services on PC like Steam, Ouya, etc)

None of them require you to be connected to the internet at least once in a 24 hour period :/ This is probably the most inconvenient digital distro as far as that is concerned.

if they're really pointing this at everyone then they really shouldn't have called it an xbox. just like the wii and wii u confusion everyone that isn't that into gaming will say 'i don't want a videogame console' and not buy one.

If they didn't call it Xbox, it probably wouldn't sell very well at all actually. Heck, its looking pretty unpleasant even with being the next Xbox. :/

This will sell just fine to the "casual-ish" market unfortunately. To both the "standard" xbox gamers (those that play CoD/Halo/Sports) and the folks that want a multimedia device that can also do the videogames.

Edited June 5, 2013 by Crowbar Man

[Cash]

Personally, I'm done buying consoles. I'm sticking with PC. I only bought consoles to play games, I have no desire pay for extra stuff that I'll never use. I understand that some people want more out of their consoles, but it's just not for me anymore. The Xbox One looks especially awful.

This sums up my thoughts on the next round of consoles.

[Clefairy]

I'd say the point is really more to go back to the drawing board with how your games, not your hardware, is produced.

So much this. Games are getting obscenely expensive to produce because the greater industry is still locked into a 'graphical arms race' mode of thinking. If you're a mega-studio with a reliable franchise, you can go that route and do well, but everyone else feels the pressure to keep up. That pressure is causing the mid-sized journeyman studios to implode, leaving us with basically two game archetypes: mega blockbuster (Call of Duty) and lo-fi indie project (Braid).

In this article, the lead on COD: Ghosts talks about the new engine they've made, and all the extra time and effort required to get the game to that visual level. He throws out an estimate of 50% more time to make a model of something. That type of work is already the biggest drain on game budgets right now, by a huge margin at that, and seeing the next generation head even further down that road is worrying.

[KyleJCrb]

So Microsoft released three new articles to explain more about the Xbox One features and how used games will be handled:

http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/license

http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/connected

http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/privacy

Personally, it seems like they've addressed most of the main issues, although the line "trade in your games at participating retailers" makes me think that you are ONLY going to be able to trade used games at authorized retailers, which means no more grey market (eBay, local trading, etc.)

[Toadofsky]

what I've read of this so far, doesn't make me want it still

[Gario]

Oh, so you can download the games digitally, and limited access to the account is possible for friends?

The system might have some prospects yet, but the burn it suffered through on the reveal might have caused it irreversable damage already. We'll see, I suppose.

[KyleJCrb]

Nope, me neither. I honestly think Microsoft has a looooong way to go as far as damage control is concerned. Three small articles probably aren't gonna cut it.

[liquid wind]

http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/privacy

Personally, it seems like they've addressed most of the main issues

Microsoft says that the kinect isn't data mining if you don't want it to, sounds legit

I wonder if Verizon's contracts also had a similar privacy statement

[Brandon Strader]

My brother and I share Xbox360 games all the time (and PS3 games too for that matter). If the thing about sharing games with 10 family members, unlimited, is true, then that will be awesome. We could both just buy 1 game and then share it. But I doubt it will work that way, AND I doubt we'll both buy Xbones. Probably neither of us. But that one simple feature is the best thing I've heard-that-probably-isn't-legit of all the info ever.

[The Legendary Zoltan]

After reading all 412 messages, here are my thoughts.

The presentation: It's for the press and was supposed to be exclusively about the hardware and not the games so I'm fine with it.

All in one: I think Zircon is right. If it only does games, it won't have a wide enough appeal and even hardcore gamers will probably start complaining later on about the lack of other functions, I think. Even the current generation doesn't solely play games. If they had just talked about the games and then later we found out that it can do all these other things, we would consider all that stuff awesome bonuses instead of being upset about it. So let's just say that was another flaw in the presentation.

Always online and Blocking used games: It is like they are treating physical media just like digital. People say that Steam has DRM but those are digital games. I feel like buying a physical disc entitles you to full ownership of the disc which includes the freedom to give it away or sell it. I think they are going this way because eventually they would like to make it require a continual connection. I don't like it.

Achievements for watching TV: That is the most hilarious nonsense I have ever heard. Microsoft wants to give people ACHIEVEMENTS FOR LITERALLY ACHIEVING NOTHING! I love it.

Kinnect: Not something I like.

Will I buy one? No. PS4 sounds more appealing to me and they have shown signs of not blocking used games in any way. That could change but if it doesn't they could get the entire hardcore market in one fell swoop, I think.

Edited June 7, 2013 by The Legendary Zoltan

[kupernikus]

Microsoft says that the kinect isn't data mining if you don't want it to, sounds legit

I wonder if Verizon's contracts also had a similar privacy statement

Yes, yes they do.

[Cerrax]

Unless Sony can prove that they learned from all their mistakes with the PS3, I'm going to remain skeptical of the PS4. Their GUI was awful, the forced installation and slow boot up time for games was stupid, PSN is a joke compared to Xbox Live, and the Blu-Ray meant practically nothing to multi-platform games because all the assets were made to fit on a DVD. Some games even managed to look worse on the PS3 because it doesn't do upscaling like the 360 does. Not to mention their exclusives (with the exception of the Ico/SotC HD remake) were not my cup of tea.

With exception of the RRoD, I've never had a problem with my Xbox 360. I enjoy Xbox Live quite a bit. The GUI is nice, and most operations are transparent rather than muddying up the screen with "I'M DOWNLOADING. NOW I'M INSTALLING. HEY ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO INSTALL THIS? SHOULD I UPDATE THIS? NO YOU CAN"T LOOK AT THE STORE BECAUSE I'M UPDATING A PIECE OF FIRMWARE YOU'LL NEVER EVER SEE."

Edited June 7, 2013 by Cerrax

[Gollgagh]

see I thought the xbox GUI was terrible but enjoyed the XMB

[zircon]

Unless Sony can prove that they learned from all their mistakes with the PS3, I'm going to remain skeptical of the PS4. Their GUI was awful, the forced installation and slow boot up time for games was stupid, PSN is a joke compared to Xbox Live, and the Blu-Ray meant practically nothing to multi-platform games because all the assets were made to fit on a DVD. Some games even managed to look worse on the PS3 because it doesn't do upscaling like the 360 does. Not to mention their exclusives (with the exception of the Ico/SotC HD remake) were not my cup of tea.

With exception of the RRoD, I've never had a problem with my Xbox 360. I enjoy Xbox Live quite a bit. The GUI is nice, and most operations are transparent rather than muddying up the screen with "I'M DOWNLOADING. NOW I'M INSTALLING. HEY ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO INSTALL THIS? SHOULD I UPDATE THIS? NO YOU CAN"T LOOK AT THE STORE BECAUSE I'M UPDATING A PIECE OF FIRMWARE YOU'LL NEVER EVER SEE."

I dunno. I really prefer the PS3's MUCH cleaner UI to the 360's bloated, ad-infested UI that is constantly shoving content in your face that you don't want to see. The PS3 is so smooth and minimal, and it feels about twice as responsive to me.

Also I think you're way off about PSN. Let's compare. In order to do just about anything with the 360 - play games online, watch Netflix, etc - you need to pay a monthly fee. Right off the bat, PSN has an advantage. It's free (and PS3 has built in wi-fi) and you can do all that stuff without paying.

Playstation Plus is leagues ahead in terms of what you get. It's about the same price but you get tons of free games and major discounts. If anything, PSPlus is the perfect example of what a subscription service should do - give you tremendous value in the form of games, games, and more games.

[kupernikus]

Unless Sony can prove that they learned from all their mistakes with the PS3, I'm going to remain skeptical of the PS4. Their GUI was awful, the forced installation and slow boot up time for games was stupid, PSN is a joke compared to Xbox Live, and the Blu-Ray meant practically nothing to multi-platform games because all the assets were made to fit on a DVD. Some games even managed to look worse on the PS3 because it doesn't do upscaling like the 360 does. Not to mention their exclusives (with the exception of the Ico/SotC HD remake) were not my cup of tea.

With exception of the RRoD, I've never had a problem with my Xbox 360. I enjoy Xbox Live quite a bit. The GUI is nice, and most operations are transparent rather than muddying up the screen with "I'M DOWNLOADING. NOW I'M INSTALLING. HEY ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO INSTALL THIS? SHOULD I UPDATE THIS? NO YOU CAN"T LOOK AT THE STORE BECAUSE I'M UPDATING A PIECE OF FIRMWARE YOU'LL NEVER EVER SEE."

So let's see,

Forced installations - Mandatory on some PS3 titles- Mandatory on ALL XBone titles.

Blu-ray - Gave PS3 an advantage as far as extra-gaming use as well as certain exclusives remaining exclusive because of disc storage.

Your claim about XBL being better than the PSN has nothing there to support it or state why. I'll say this, outside of me having more friends on XBL, it's not worth 10-15$ a month for what you get. Let's look at it, access to other companies servers or other players machines? Access to services such as Hulu/Netflix/hboGo that you already pay for? Access to the internet/youtube? Yep outside of voice chat those are all things I get for FREE on the ps3.

Exclusives not being your thing is fine, Im in the same boat I only own a half dozen or so PS3 games on disc, and only a few more from PSN, the PS3 wasn't really my console of choice this gen.

The one thing I will say you got right is the ridiculous amount of updates and firmware installs the PSN does.

[Ramaniscence]

I dunno. I really prefer the PS3's MUCH cleaner UI to the 360's bloated, ad-infested UI that is constantly shoving content in your face that you don't want to see. The PS3 is so smooth and minimal, and it feels about twice as responsive to me.

The original Playstation Store was pretty miserable compared to the XBOX 360 store, but pretty recently Sony made it MUCH MUCH better.

Also: Matchmaking on PS3 for me was pretty similar to the XBOX experience (I played a few games on both because I have friends that own different consoles), though XBOX did handle friends better in general.

[Gollgagh]

but pretty recently Sony made it MUCH MUCH better.

I'm not that impressed by it

they went from a buggy piece of shit to a laggy piece of shit

Edited June 7, 2013 by Gollgagh

[The Legendary Zoltan]

Say what? Although the new search functions and filtering system is better, I prefer the old Playstation Store by far because it never lagged at all. Maybe it's because of my unbelievable internet connection. I don't know. The new one doesn't respond until three seconds after I have pushed a button.

[Gollgagh]

sorry, I used the wrong qualifier

I still like the new one less than the old one

[EC2151]

I am looking forward to seeing the rationalization gamers are going to give for buying the most anti-consumer console ever conceived.

[The Coop]

I am looking forward to seeing the rationalization gamers are going to give for buying the most anti-consumer console ever conceived.

Halo 5.

[zircon]

Here's the thing about consumers and the products they buy. Take this from a business owner... people only care about something insomuch as it affects them. That is not to say everyone is SELFISH. You might be against "anti-consumer" products because you as a person value that cause, and it makes you feel good to support it. However, most people really don't care about this stuff. People on forums like this, or even larger sites like Reddit, are not at all a good representation of the majority of America. Most people do not buy (or not buy) things 'on principle', but rather because it fulfills a need. The Xbox One is a home entertainment device for the living room, obviously focused on games. People will buy it despite all the other issues if it fulfills that need.

It's like how there was so much outrage about Diablo 3 always requiring an internet connection. You would think that it would do terribly based on how many people online said they would never support it, and yet, it was a record seller. Likewise, all the people that rail against DLC are dwarfed by the people that buy DLC because it gives them enjoyment.