Jorito

That's a good writeup and I think it frames things nicely from a listener's perspective too. Nowadays, VGM remixes and covers are a more common thing than they used to be, and I am not sure how listeners do perceive a song from OCR versus a track from, say, Materia Collective. Do they mind, do they care, or do they just like to listen to a nice remix and are they not too bothered with the remixing criteria OCR upholds? Production quality is a bit different IMO, because there is like a common lowest threshold if I am to judge it by e.g. Materia Collective or random (popular) VGM artists on Youtube. Do I take OCR (too) seriously? Perhaps, but I also used it as a motivator to improve myself, and having this decent threshold helped stimulate me to do so. Maybe that's not for everybody because not everybody is as crazy as I am, but your point on listener perception is a valid one, because I also do this because there's other people besides myself who enjoy what I do. I am not sure what the common issues with the current bar are. Maybe it would be interesting to have a look at the more recent NO'ed tracks and see what the common patterns are. Makes it also less anecdotal and personal if you go beyond just fussing about your own NO'ed track.

I am a noob with Symphonic Orchestra. I did a trailer style track a few years back (http://ocremix.org/remix/OCR03226) and none of the judges nagged me about poor sample quality. Might be an incident, I don't know. I agree that it is incredibly hard to get good sound quality with free soundfonts (I know I can't, but I am also not stupid enough to try). My whole point is that, in stead of going "boohoo, they NO'ed me" and putting it all on the other party, also take a step back and try to look at yourself and your work objectively and see if the feedback has some merit in stead of feeling all agitated and offended about it. Anyway, let's just agree to disagree on this one. I assume that the "scrutinize YES votes more thoroughly" is about the incident with the Big Bad Koopa dubstep remix? I am not sure if it's something that has happened more often these past years to warrant such a step or if it was an incident that happened only once 6 (!) years ago. Other than that, it seems a good list to talk about. A summary of bullet 3 would help. I would like to add a 'Make judge queue progress panel more visible and transparent' to it as well, myself.

In my submits, I usually have a nice writeup about my intentions and choices for the track as well as my inspiration. Not sure if they take it into account, I just do it because I like to add that bit of retrospect. I hardly ever mention the samples I use, and I wouldn't expect any leeway or extra credits based on that. Feel free to try it, but I seriously doubt your samples are going to get you a NO. IANAJ, but it's very likely more in how you used them as well as some other things combined that give you a NO or a NO (resubmit). Maybe focus on improving yourself with these other things in stead in stead of hoping for leniency because of sample choice? Anyway, we're sidestepping from the main discussion about judging, influx of new artists and whatnot. Maybe we should go back on said topic.

Just wanted to point out that if you want to do a trailer-style track, that goes with certain expectations from both listeners (and hence staff). With regards to sounds used, structure, arrangement and whatnot. Since any trailer music you hear tries to be pretty realistic, your track would stand out like a sore thumb when you use soundfonts or sibelius and don't try to achieve a similar realistic sound. You probably _can_ do it with free samples and soundfonts, but it means you need to work a lot harder on it and more skill than the out-of-the-box experience you get with current sample libs. Again, the right tools for the right job. If you don't have the tools, ask yourself really hard if you can do a good job. Maybe you should pick another style/genre that works better with what you have. Yes, I am not a fan of people complaining they got rejected because they made a poor genre choice up front and couldn't get it to work and meet general expectations. Now, maybe I should go find my poorest PS1 level samples and try to make a PS1 style track and submit it to see if my assumption is actually valid

Ever considered _not_ making _realistic_ orchestral stuff if you don't have the equipment to handle it? In Dark Souls it gets you killed, in OCR land you get NO'ed Seriously, with the sample stuff you listed, you might get PS1 era level sounds, which can be good if you are doing this kind of retro vibe. And if you would do a track in that style, with those instruments, where clearly you choose it for stylistic purposes rather than try to be realistic, I don't think it would be a problem on the panel. But epic realistic orchestra? As you said, it's very hard with the stuff you listed, so why be a mad man about it and try anyway? Nobody is expecting you to buy expensive sample libs and software, just as much as nobody is telling you to make realistic orchestral music. Seems a bit like a self-inflicted pipe dream to me. I am also not gonna be like "all I have is a banana and a didgeridoo, but that will not stop me from making the most brütal metal known to man"...

Epic wall of text is epic. And clarifying. I'll grant you guys that the eval process is quicker these days (as long as you keep in mind that eval might be quick but it might take a good amount of time to get it actually posted!) but for me as a poor ol' remixer that's a bit hard to see. Sure, tracks that get NO'ed end up quite quickly in the judge decision forum, but for tracks that are either YES'ed, under judgement or pending in the queue there's not a lot of visibility unless somebody takes up the (manual) chore of updating the 'Currently in the Judging Process' topic. Personally I think it'd be awesome to have this automated and more visible (and faster), but I'm not sure how feasible -or desirable- that is.

I think the standards of what a track needs to bring in order to be posted on the homepage has also grown over the years. If you look back at earlier mixes, quite a few of them wouldn't be posted these days. So the quality standards have evolved as the musicians making the music (and the easy access and sheer quality of today's music software and knowledge) have grown. Which I think is a good thing. It's probably also a really tricky balance to define where that low threshold of quality should be. Put it too high, and you end up discouraging newer remixers (even though some might meet it as a game to match and try and beat; I know I did!). Put it too low, and you end up discouraging those musicians who are further along on their musical journey and want to be in a community with people with similar level. Uniting those 2 contradicting positions might actually be impossible. And maybe you shouldn't. Having the jury and some barrier on getting posted on the homepage does alleviate it to something of a kind of Champions League, if you will, and also makes it a kind of special event. I know I always look forward to getting mixposted. Anyway, it might not be a bad idea to expand this Champions League with a Premier League and maybe even a First Division kind of thing, with a lower threshold. You could for example consider remixes that are being evaluated in the Workshop and getting a pass from the mods there to be in a separate list of their own (the Premier League) and maybe a First Division kind of thing for the tracks that get a NO, resub mark from the panel. Not a new idea, because this is actually pretty similar to the next goal on OCR's Patreon page. And yes, judges just being human will mean that sometimes their subjective opinions will be a pain, and yes, they will nitpick about stuff you might feel different about. But copy/paste is something I would tend to agree on with them; this is a remixing community, not a copy/paste community. Show your creative chops, that's the whole point. That creativity extends to getting whatever stuff you have to sound good, without requiring you to have all the fancy sample libs and synths. That kind of production work is not everybody's cup of tea (I cheat by using these fancy sample libs and synths if I feel like it), but don't let "I don't have fancy thing X" be an excuse for being lazy at it

Heh, in my mind eval and judging (in this context) are pretty similar; you get feedback from a critical listener that shares their opinion on the piece whether or not it's OCR-postable quality. Anyway, I get your point and distinction. I have no gripes with eval, apart from not using it myself often enough and moreso for not giving enough feedback in the workshop myself. And fair is fair, you guys did start a convo about it.

Despite the mad man rave you do here, I do have to admit that said remix ain't bad. Wasn't feeling the ending, but that would be the biggest remark I'd have. Whether or not it's deemed postable is ultimately up to the judges, because that's how this community works, take it or leave it. While I do agree that this whole eval process (and the time it takes) can be daunting for newcomers, it also guarantees a good base level, and -if you're patient enough to wait for it- the feedback is usually (meant) constructive and you can use it to learn and grow as a musician. At least, that's how I always approached it. Sure, I don't always agree with the evals I get (especially if it ain't positive :P), but in stead of getting butthurt I just keep in mind that these are just opinions of people that are good at critical listening and that they mean well. Using this thread for a _constructive_ discussion on judge/eval improvements would be interesting tho. My pet peeve is that eval takes a looong time and happens somewhat in a black box (I'm looking at you, 'Currently in eval' thread), both things that are tough sells in this age of instant gratification. $0.02.

Yesterday I received the full album eval from staff. If you're an artist on the album, you should have received it in your inbox. The good news is that we're on track for release later this month. Even better is that we still have a bit of time to make the album even better than it already is Anyway, stay tuned!

@Kylok you game? Or maybe @Guifrog? Anyone else?

If you don’t mind used stuff: I’ve also bought a few licenses through the forums on kvraudio.com. There’s plenty of selling and reselling going on there and the community is good at keeping it sane and healthy.

I kinda liked those breaths in there, gave it a bit more emotion. But you are right, they were pretty pronounced, so I did an update where the breaths are pretty much reduced and hardly noticeable (I wanted to let them a tiny tiny bit in): http://www.jorito.net/files/fragments/Moments - Jorito feat. JoyDreamer %26 Chris ~ Amaterasu.mp3

Finally finished my arrangement of "Fragment of Memories" from FF8. Originally created for the FF8 album project here on OCR, but when that got stalled I decided it was too good not to finish it. It also was a great excuse to collab with JoyDreamer and @Chris ~ Amaterasu again Ladies and gentlemen, I give you "Moments". Enjoy!

Interesting arrangement, I like it Not much to criticize, or it would be that I find the snare a bit weak and buried at places (e.g. the middle bit around 1:30 and the part that starts at 2:20). Also the ending could be a bit stronger. I would probably cut it off at 3:01, nice and dramatic. Also, with the vibe you have going on, it might be nice to dirty it up with some bit crushing and glitching; I think it would go well with this style.

Depending on timeframe I think I’m game. One of the tracks that’s very familiar to me and it deserves a good remix. Style-wise I think I’m pretty flexible and I can definitely help out on the arrangement side of things. Anyone else game?

So we've sent the album off to OCR staff for evaluation last week. Now it's a matter of waiting for their feedback In the background we're hard at work finishing off the track order, the artwork and miscellaneous bits 'n bobs. so that we can make the release as smooth as can be. No final confirmed release date as of yet, just stay tuned for any updates on the regular OCR channels!

Hm, interesting, I might have something I've joined the Discord to bug you about it.

You know that usually I'd be game for a compo, especially since last Castlevania was a lot of fun. Gotta skip this one though, did another compo, 2 album directing & arrangement jobs as well as a few other musical projects this year already, so I think I can use a break I'll keep an eye out, if timing changes I might jump aboard anyway. Also, minor correction, I was pretty sure I won the last compo through the Dracula bracket, beating Simon with a curse

For the lurkers out there that watched the first post in this topic, you've might noticed that some rapid progress has been made and that we're nearly done with all the music. It's looking (and sounding) very good, we'll check in with more news once we have it!

Would be nice indeed! Now that a few tracks of mine passed the panel, and having thoroughly read the evals, I think I have a decent sense of how the individual judges do their thing, and also what things they will typically point out. I could list my findings here, but it would be better to hear it from the folks themselves Oh, and compliments on the excellent clickbait title

The bass seems a bit indistinct to me, and I felt the piano would work better with longer, more sustained chords to fill up the space a bit more. To me, they sound a bit chopped off now. Maybe even make it an e-piano, for the soul & chill vibe, but that might also just me being too fond of e-piano's due to the Persona 5 OST As soon as you add raps to it, I think it'll be fine and I think you wouldn't need more elements to it. Maybe add some ear candy at strategic places, transition effects, sound effects or some sound design trickery to spice it up?

Here's a track I did for the Robot vs Knight compo a while back. It's a remix of Shovel Knight's track "Strike the Earth" and Megaman 5's track "Mercury". If you ever wanted to hear Shovel Knight recount his thoughts on the world, give it a spin Kudos to Stephen Kelly and Furorezu for collaborating with me on such short notice!

So about a month for the final deadline, and we're making good progress so far! The artwork for the front cover is now finished, and if you look at the opening post, you can already see a sneak preview Other than that, @evktalo claimed "Together Always" and I myself claimed "Whisper and Mantra" and "Flight into the Unknown". We also saw some check-ins from people already, with @HeavyViper, @Blake Inc., @Thirdkoopa, @Starphoenix, @Rexy and @djpretzel showing some very promising updates of their tracks. Really looking forward to the final versions; what we've heard so far is great stuff and I can't wait to get the album out Good luck with the last stretch, and keep up the good work guys!

I was already doing some small things for this album in the background, but I've talked with Nika a bit (disclosure: he's my co-director for the Secret of Mana album that's currently in progress) and I am also on board to help out a bit more pro-actively. My work on the Secret of Mana album goes first, but if anyone needs a hand with their arrangement or production work, let me know. I can help both as advisor/sounding board or actively working out the kinks in your track, if needed. Don't be shy, just reach out.