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No seriously, music elitists need to take a long walk off a short pier.


Malaki-LEGEND.sys
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So, back to the original point...

So I was looking around for a few cool mixes that I needed to download again, and read some of the judge reviews on a few of them. I immediately choked on my own laughter for a few seconds. What kind of nerve does it take to rip on an otherwise awesome song simply because it doesn't follow your holy opinion on what it should be? Who died and made you fuhrer?

What mixes are we talking about? Stuff that got rejected. Stuff that got passed, but criticized on some level? Tends to go back to the whole "are they biased?" argument, but I've been there long enough to see that that's not happening to any significant extent. Of course, since I am a theory major myself, I may just be missing something. I do inherently want all submissions to sound like my material.

Less musical openness, more judgehate.

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Classically trained music students aren't your problem. I've been going to school for Music Education with Focus on Tuba and Trombone for six long years. While I've been wasting my life away in music school, I've noticed that most of the people in the department are more open minded than most.

It's usually the crazy punk rock kids, or the electronica guys that get snobby with music in my experience.

Granted, while the classically trained aren't as big in numbers for elitism, the elitists that are there are so hardcore that I wonder how they function in life.

I'd like to second that.

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if genres didn't exist, somehow... this problem would be completely eliminated

it's the same with politics: if there were no parties, we'd get a lot more done

also, punk rock kids and electronica nerds are definitely NOT the snobbiest of the music snobs

try to talk to an "INDIE KID" about music for more than 3 seconds... they win, bar none

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Do I need to point out that there aren't "good" and "bad" genres?

Good and bad music is not limited to any one type.

Anyone who'll write off an entire genre is, frankly, just being a fucknob.

And said fucknobs should be thought of as distinct entities from those "elitist assholes" who'll tell you that Nickelback is a shitty band despite how awesome you think they are.

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There's critique, then there's faggotry. Haven't seen much faggotry lately though. Except for maybe one of my ReMixes, for remixing the wrong song.

"It's definitely better quality than most Chrono Symphonic, but I don't like the source material at all. Even though there is mucho expansion from that, I know that every second that it is going to go back to that theme that I don't like. In my opinionz, if you want non-boring orchestral with a good tune, check out Russel Cox's EVO mix. Probably one of the only orchestral mixes I have on the site. I like Nigel Simmons's Castlevania 4 arrangement too, but not as much as the EVO one, on a personal level."

Thanks that helps give me ideas on how to improve.

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Frankly, I think how things are run at OCR are just fine - just about everything that is raised that is a minor/major issue DOES irk me and I notice that stuff too. It's not music elitism, it's just about how well music accomplishes what it goes for.

Actual music elitism and snobbishness is bad - my father is the perfect example of that, listening to only contemporary music, largely from the classic & romance eras.

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I'm generally turned off whenever some people make snide comments based on their prejudice of an entire genre. I'm not really into rap, R&B and electronica, but one has to have a sense of acceptance about them before getting into the boring old tirades against them.

I don't even need to get into the details concerning Country music either.

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also, punk rock kids and electronica nerds are definitely NOT the snobbiest of the music snobs

try to talk to an "INDIE KID" about music for more than 3 seconds... they win, bar none

Indie is exactly where I was going with punk rock kids. I can't for the life of me find any consistent definition, or even similar trait, among "indie" music except that the music is not at all popular or well known. Then all of the sudden as soon as you get popular, your old indie fans start to hate you and call you a sell out. Green Day for example. If I had to choose a "sell out" moment for them, it would be Boulevard of Broken Dreams, but really only because I hate that song. Indie kids, however, already hated Green Day for selling out before I had even gotten the chance to buy Dookie in the stores.

That's what I call elitism.

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Just as long as well agree that metal > than all other forms of music, we can get along just fine. ;)

Seriously though, I hate music elitism, but I do have my fair share of it, mainly when it comes from mainstream sources and generally stems from modern R&B, pop, hip hop and modern rock. Sure there are bands that I enjoy that have sold millions, but those are outnumbered by the bands I enjoy from the underground. Of course, there is a shitload of garbage in the underground as well. If I like it, I like it.

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Seriously though, I hate music elitism, but I do have my fair share of it, mainly when it comes from mainstream sources and generally stems from modern R&B, pop, hip hop and modern rock. Sure there are bands that I enjoy that have sold millions, but those are outnumbered by the bands I enjoy from the underground. Of course, there is a shitload of garbage in the underground as well. If I like it, I like it.

That is a paradox that nobody can really wrap their heads around. Some people I know are quick to snub popular music simply because they're popular. But a lot of them are actually very good at what they do or at the very least, know how to sell their music to be that successful. The other way is true as well since some great musicians just couldn't find an outlet to sell their stuff. I really don't buy some romantic ideal that underground artists stay that way because they simply want to. I'm sure if they had the chance to make it big, they would.

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let's call a fictional band "Talented, Creative, & Accessible"

TCA starts out early on as young adults, writing music and playing local shows... they become popular with their friends and family and start to catch on over the internet through websites like myspace

TCA gets a big break by opening for a much more well-established band that shares their genre, and they sell lots of demos at the show

TCA now has many more fans and finally records a full album on an indie label... the fact that the label is "indie" spurs a huge influx of new fans that wear chuck taylors like they just hit stores yesterday

TCA realizes that they can get even more fans by accepting "indie" as a genre and changing their sound to be more experimental and risky... they change their name to "Talented & Creative" to reflect the difference

TC now has a very large fanbase from pretty diverse backgrounds, and they finally score a record deal with a major label... their first album on the label is recorded and released, and it sounds just like they want it to

TC gains a multitude of fans due to the major label advertising and publicity, touring with their first album is also a success... however, when they decide to record an EP, it is not quite as well-recieved as their album

TC decides to modify their style to better fit the needs of the label and all the fans that came with it... thus becoming "Talented"

T retains fans from the label and gains many more through music videos, radio time, and other mainstream attention... this lasts for maybe 2 more full-length albums, and interest with the masses fades

T is now in a strange position, because while they were enjoying the spotlight, they were oblivious to the fact that all of their old fans left them

T is boring to the mainstream, and a sellout to the underground... band break-up in t-minus one year

talent is a terrible thing to waste, but the music industry almost ensures it

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Stuff about "TCA"

talent is a terrible thing to waste, but the music industry almost ensures it

That is an interesting blurb. On the one hand, you have artists who fall squarely into this category. E. S. Posthumous comes to mind. Talented brothers weave classical/electronica music. Get popular over the internet. Get signed by CBS. Do shitty rap song for CBS. Lose most of their original fanbase. Disappear from the face of the Earth.

Then there's stories like Rob Dougan. Guy starts mixing classical and blues influences into breakbeat/hip hop rhythms. Gets lots of gigs at clubs. Gets noticed by the dudes of "The Matrix" Releases an "indie" album. Refuses to change style to suit a label. Disappears from the face of the Earth.

And then there's stories like Type O Negative. Talented goth/metal group captures audience. Gets a small label. Moves to bigger label. Pisses off the bigger label for not complying with album criteria. Finds another label. Pisses off that label for not following album criteria. Continues to hop from label to label while refusing to give up creative control. Never hits as big as previous two stories, but is nonetheless successful and has a fairly large, loyal fanbase.

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The greatest music in the world is whatever you like.

Depends on what viewpoint of "greatest" you look at. If you're talking about how well the music does what it aims at, then no, this is the most ridiculous viewpoint ever - it is demeaning to composers, serious musicians, or anyone who cares about structure.

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