Indiana Jones 4

[Bleck]

(not a spoiler) Why were there so many moles in the beginning?

groundhogs

[Blake]

This was the first movie to truly disturb me as far as tombs/artifacts go. I thought the crystal skulls were really creepy. The refrigerator thing was out there, but still hilarious. I'm more worried about people's ability to survive three waterfall drops.

[Dhsu]

groundhogs

Was I the only one to hear the notes from Encounters at the end, during the big twister ?

I didn't catch it, but the whole scene was a very obvious Encounters homage (perhaps even a direct crossover), and it doesn't surprise me that Spielberg couldn't resist throwing in the musical cue to complete the reference.

[Nekofrog]

I still haven't seen it, but to people ragging on its pacing and editing:

Go back and watch Raiders of the Lost Ark. I watched it a few days ago for the first time in 15 years, and was amazed at how utterly lost I was. Protags are here -- bam they're there -- wait where are they now? -- who was that? -- what just happened?

Its linearity seems extremely compromised, as it just jumps at random and only makes sense cognitively if you've seen it multiple times.

Unlike Temple of Doom/Last Crusade, which are both so incredibly easy to follow that they're just far more enjoyable. The characters don't just randomly appear in a new location, you see the journey there or at least have it mentioned before they make it.

That's why I rank Ark dead last in the original trilogy. Is the editing in that regard more similar to Ark or the other two?

[The Author]

The guy should have died in the first 5 minutes of the first movie.

[Lotd2242]

Completely fails as an Indiana Jones movie, but still not as bad as some of the other sequels I've seen recently.

Also there's suspension of disbelief...and then there's what they did with this movie.

[Zup]

The guy should have died in the first 5 minutes of the first movie.

I would have watched that. And enjoyed it more than Indy 4.

[The Author]

I would have watched that. And enjoyed it more than Indy 4.

Do you even know how to enjoy movies anymore?

Indy 4, or any Indiana Jones movie are not movies you should think too much about. The trick is to turn off your brain and enjoy the ride. And as that kind of movie, it worked perfectly.

If you want to have a debate about the intellectual worth of a movie, go in a small theater where you can eat an apple and read the Serbian subtitles.

They never promised anything more than an adventure movie about an dude with a whip. They delivered. The plot wasn't any worse than any other Indiana Jones movie. It was on the same levels as the other, however you saw the first three with the eyes of a kid, and you never actually judged them as harshly as people are judging Indiana Jones 4 here.

[LuckyXIII]

When they introduced the psychic and the premise of psychic military might, it reminded me of Metal Gear. At the moment I'm going through MGS3, so with the jungle setting it made me think of what a Metal Gear movie may be like if Indiana Jones replaced Solid Snake. The characters are kind of similar, but Indy isn't as bitter as Snake.

Then there's a scene where it suddenly felt kind of like a Metroid movie.

All around, this film reminds me more of Temple of Doom than Raiders or Last Crusade.

[Lemonectric]

Do you even know how to enjoy movies anymore?

Indy 4, or any Indiana Jones movie are not movies you should think too much about. The trick is to turn off your brain and enjoy the ride. And as that kind of movie, it worked perfectly.

If you want to have a debate about the intellectual worth of a movie, go in a small theater where you can eat an apple and read the Serbian subtitles.

They never promised anything more than an adventure movie about an dude with a whip. They delivered. The plot wasn't any worse than any other Indiana Jones movie. It was on the same levels as the other, however you saw the first three with the eyes of a kid, and you never actually judged them as harshly as people are judging Indiana Jones 4 here.

I agree with all this. Sure, it wasn't an amazing, groundbreaking movie, but it did what it set out to do: entertain. I don't think I could really rank the Indiana Jones movies if I wanted to, but Indy 4 was definitely on par with the older ones, in my opinion.

I mean, seriously. All the other movies had equally ridiculous parts in them. They're not trying to be believable. They're trying to be entertaining.

[Zup]

The problem was is that I was willing to believe it, but after a certain point they began not trying. I did enjoy the movie, but I would have enjoyed it more if it were less like a B-Movie and more like Indiana.

[DarkeSword]

less like a B-Movie and more like Indiana.

You've missed the point.

[The Author]

The problem was is that I was willing to believe it, but after a certain point they began not trying. I did enjoy the movie, but I would have enjoyed it more if it were less like a B-Movie and more like Indiana.

Indiana Jones is SUPPOSED TO BE A B MOVIE.

That's he big idea: A simple relaxing movie. The first ones were made as a parallel to adventure films, this one would have betrayed its origins if it has been any different, and it would have been a bad Indiana Jones movie.

[Zup]

Indiana Jones is SUPPOSED TO BE A B MOVIE.

That's he big idea: A simple relaxing movie. The first ones were made as a parallel to adventure films, this one would have betrayed its origins if it has been any different, and it would have been a bad Indiana Jones movie.

No. The first ones were homages to 1930s serials. This one was an homage to 50's b-movies. I didn't like the change in style, so sue me.

[Bleck]

In before Zup's idea of an A movie is like Spiderman 3 or something

[The Author]

No. The first ones were homages to 1930s serials. This one was an homage to 50's b-movies. I didn't like the change in style, so sue me.

What was so different with this one?

The pacing? It seemed pretty close.

The plot? Mystical artifact with supernatural powers, sounds about right.

The action? Fight scenes, kinda gross types of deaths, and traps in a ruin, there again.

What was so different between this and all three other movies (which I watched fairly recently thanks to global.)

[burnham909]

Im getting me one of those refrigerators, I dont know about you guys.

[Lotd2242]

For the record, I don't disagree the movie was mildly entertaining, but it failed completely as an Indy movie.

A B movie is not a "simple relaxing movie." A B movie is a cheap, half-assed flick made for people who want to go to the drive-in and not feel bad about missing most of it. Indy is based on the action serials of the 30s and 40s, not the SciFi horror crap in the 50s.

The B-movie feel might have worked given the timeframe, except that they took it to the point of absurdity.

Indiana Jones always stuck to the realm of the plausible, mixing in a little fantastical of which Indy was always skeptical until the end. This movie gives the plausible the finger in the first 15 minutes. A 5 year old knows that fridge thing is bullshit.

Indiana Jones was always supposed to be an ordinary guy who happened to get into trouble when out digging in the dirt. He got out of his scrapes with mostly luck and quick wit. In this movie, he's just superhuman. This script would've been far better served for a James Bond movie than an Indy film.

[The Author]

For the record, I don't disagree the movie was mildly entertaining, but it failed completely as an Indy movie.

A B movie is not a "simple relaxing movie." A B movie is a cheap, half-assed flick made for people who want to go to the drive-in and not feel bad about missing most of it. Indy is based on the action serials of the 30s and 40s, not the SciFi horror crap in the 50s.

The B-movie feel might have worked given the timeframe, except that they took it to the point of absurdity.

Indiana Jones always stuck to the realm of the plausible, mixing in a little fantastical of which Indy was always skeptical until the end. This movie gives the plausible the finger in the first 15 minutes. A 5 year old knows that fridge thing is bullshit.

Indiana Jones was always supposed to be an ordinary guy who happened to get into trouble when out digging in the dirt. He got out of his scrapes with mostly luck and quick wit. In this movie, he's just superhuman. This script would've been far better served for a James Bond movie than an Indy film.

While I don't deny the fridge was a stretch, they did show that it was Lead lined, and it was blown away at the first shock wave, and not the second. However, in the second movie, he survived someone having his hand in his chest. That one was a lot less plausible if you know a bit of medicine.

Also, as for the plot in general, visitors bringing knowledge is not only a frequent theory, it is a respectable one considering the unique spikes in technological evolution mankind has known. The pre-colombian religions in south america have interestingly common references to celestial beings, chariots made of gold, and other "alien-like" elements. I personally believe that the proof of the existence of aliens may very well rest in our past, rather than in the sky.

[Malaki-LEGEND.sys]

For the record, I don't disagree the movie was mildly entertaining, but it failed completely as an Indy movie.

A B movie is not a "simple relaxing movie." A B movie is a cheap, half-assed flick made for people who want to go to the drive-in and not feel bad about missing most of it. Indy is based on the action serials of the 30s and 40s, not the SciFi horror crap in the 50s.

The B-movie feel might have worked given the timeframe, except that they took it to the point of absurdity.

Indiana Jones always stuck to the realm of the plausible, mixing in a little fantastical of which Indy was always skeptical until the end. This movie gives the plausible the finger in the first 15 minutes. A 5 year old knows that fridge thing is bullshit.

Indiana Jones was always supposed to be an ordinary guy who happened to get into trouble when out digging in the dirt. He got out of his scrapes with mostly luck and quick wit. In this movie, he's just superhuman. This script would've been far better served for a James Bond movie than an Indy film.

I think it's pretty much a given that you fail at movie-going.

[Zup]

Well, let's see. My problems with the new Indiana are multiple. One: too many sidekicks. In the originals, I got to know Short Round, or Marion, or Marcus Brody because they were all treated with the same respect and character development. In this one, I hardly know Mac, who switches sides more than once as if it was funny, Marion is a ghost of her former self and the only one I even connect with halfway decently, Mutt, is not given the same level of depth that was given to Henry Sr. that made you enjoy watching the movie.

And another problem: what's with the crappy CGI everywhere? I can name two or three instances in the original where the special effects were noticable and detracted from the movie (ie, the Ark finale, the Doom finale, and, well, the Grail finale). In this one, the special effects were everywhere and visibly took me outside the movie. The ants were probably the least fake, but even they looked terrible. The CGI was used far too much. Does anyone else remember the awesome stunts in the others, such as fighting on a plane just before everything blows up, or maybe the boat chase in the Holy Grail, let alone the opening boulder-chase scene. The fencing scene looked just as fake as the other shots, taking me once more out of the film.

While I can seriously enjoy an Indy movie, it's the ability of the movie to take me there instead of constantly reminding me of it's falsity that I can't connect at all. That is why this movie fails. And I would say this about any movie, not just Indy; I'm not letting my nostalgia tainted eyes glorify a film that doesn't deserve it. I'm basing my judgment on what makes a movie good on just that; not other Indy films, regardless how much I loved them.

[Lotd2242]

While I don't deny the fridge was a stretch, they did show that it was Lead lined, and it was blown away at the first shock wave, and not the second. However, in the second movie, he survived someone having his hand in his chest. That one was a lot less plausible if you know a bit of medicine.

Also, as for the plot in general, visitors bringing knowledge is not only a frequent theory, it is a respectable one considering the unique spikes in technological evolution mankind has known. The pre-colombian religions in south america have interestingly common references to celestial beings, chariots made of gold, and other "alien-like" elements. I personally believe that the proof of the existence of aliens may very well rest in our past, rather than in the sky.

There is no way to defend the fridge bit, certainly not by comparing it to something that's part of the mysticism of an artifact Indy went to find. He's dead in SO many ways it's not even funny. Spoilers: First, he would've been incinerated. The air in the fridge would've superheated from the flash and cooked him like a Nazi oven. Then it would've been sucked out and he would've suffocated. Then the initial shockwave would've hit, killing him by smashing his body against the inside of the fridge as it accelerated him to some speed faster than that car was going, not to mention the sudden repressurization of the fridge. Then if that did not do the trick, getting smacked against it again as it hit the ground and tumbled would've no doubt killed him. Not to mention the door mechanism almost certainly would not have survived those stresses, and thus tossed him out into the air as it tumbled. Also, despite being in a "lead lined" fridge, he would've received a lethal dose of radiation being that close to the explosion and having that little lead protecting him. Even if he didn't get it in the fridge, he sure as hell would've after he got out from either the radiation in the air or the radioactive debris raining upon him. And if, IF, by some utter miracle he survived that, he probably would've died wandering around the desert absorbing that much more radiation while trying to find help, which would've been miles away especially with all of the soldiers dead. This is all assuming the fridge got launched, which it probably would not have. More likely due to its weight it would've been one of the last things to move from the initial shockwave and thus be more likely to either be sucked towards the blast by the backpressure or essentially remain in place.

There are only two reasons I can think of that someone would allow such an egregious depiction. One is that Lucas likes CGI and the other is that they wanted to set up the washing gag.

The visitor theory is not generally considered a respectable one in the scientific community, even though I agree it's possible. Even still, the movie handled that aspect so badly that it didn't matter. I had no beef with that and would've given it a complete pass otherwise.

You asked what was missing from the movie that made it unworthy of Indiana Jones' namesake. There was no mysticism in the movie. There was no feeling of danger. The skull became a silly gimmick that had no purpose at all. It even looked goofy as hell, inspiring no awe, no wonder. The quest they're on is more of a fumbling run through the jungle than a search for something too powerful to let fall into enemy hands. And the enemy invokes no trepidation, has no barbaric quality to make them seem as though their getting to the goal first would be something to fear. Even the score was weak. Thus Indy is reduced to an invulnerable superhero who can do no wrong against a weak enemy that can do nothing right searching for something that doesn't seem worth the effort with an artifact that is laughable at best. It was, as I said, essentially a Bond movie minus the gadgets.

I think it's pretty much a given that you fail at movie-going.

I think it's pretty much a given that all you need to be entertained are some pretty, flashing lights.

[Wintermute]

Just saw it this last weekend.

Average at best. Some very entertaining parts, but as a whole it fails as an Indy movie on many levels.

[cerberus86]

Lol, i agree though, the movie was only average. i'll give it a 5 in a scale from 1 to 10, for its action and CG. The movie does not score well cuz it does not really meet (at least) my expectation. Too little "swing" and udder indiana jones action move. Plus viewer can already guess bout the plots and stuff, no surprise and twist. And Harrison Ford IS getting old, LOL

I'm better off watching Lara Croft

[DJ Silly C]

You guys are sitting here saying how bad Indy 4 is.. I have no clue why? I understand I don't know your age... Nor do I know if you guys have actually seen the other three movies? I think the movie was very very good especially since Harrison Ford is in his mid 60's plus did all his own stunts... There is a sub story in the movie which I think most of you failed to see. I have been a long Indiana Jones fan since I was a kid.. Just so you guys don't think I'm like some 50 yr old comming down on ya.. I'm only 27. Indy 4 was better then "The Temple of Doom" and about the same as "Raiders of the Lost Ark." I don't care about wether or not other life forms were involved.. It's Indiana Jones!!!!! There's a boat load of Actuall history involved in the movie like all the others.. I liked the fact that Marion was re-introduced into the film. I like the fact that Indy has a son now.. You can start to see the relationship between them build.. Indy starts mildly treating him like Indy's father treated Indy in "The Last Crusade" as far as the use of special effects... WHO cares....!!! Seriously if you think about it.. .90% of all movies have special effects and lots of them... Indy 4 had about the same amount of Special Effects as the other 3 movies did.. I think that too many people went into seeing that movie with the Idea that Indy 4 was going to be exactly like the other 3 movies.. Go back and see the movie and consider AGE, The Era which it takes place in... LOOK FOR THE SUB STORY!! If you really think about it the movie was actually really good!! Sorry for the rant I had just woken up!! I'm sure you all know how brains work when you first wake up!!!! Lata