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FireSlash

OCR TF2: Stab stab stab!

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We played Swiftwater just yesterday and it has gone through some major improvements. It is much more vibrant and fun to play than previous versions. I think that most everyone enjoyed it very much.

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We played Swiftwater just yesterday and it has gone through some major improvements. It is much more vibrant and fun to play than previous versions. I think that most everyone enjoyed it very much.

I didn enjoy it very much, and wanted to nominate it tonight, but didn't get a chance too..

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Note how almost everything suggested to counter 3 heavies takes more work than just getting three heavies to walk up to a payload and start shooting.

You're kidding, right? You think demo + stickies is harder than getting 3 heavies to walk up to a cart and start shooting? Or that building a sentry gun is (especially now that you can move them)?

You know you're delusional, right?

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This came up more than once tonight, so I'll post it here: What do people think about making one or both of the servers nocrit?

I'd be good if even one of the servers had random crits as well as damage spread turned off. If that's not an option what about reserved slot holders having the ability to bring up a crit vote without having to get a majority?

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On a related note, I've always wondered why waffleshots are on.

Maybe BLU could be the more vanilla server with random crits, damage spread, and no waffleshots (random shot spread? Not sure what it's called.), while RED has no random crits, no damage spread, and waffleshots on.

If I understand the thinking behind the stuff anyway.

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On a related note, I've always wondered why waffleshots are on.

Maybe BLU could be the more vanilla server with random crits, damage spread, and no waffleshots (random shot spread? Not sure what it's called.), while RED has no random crits, no damage spread, and waffleshots on.

If I understand the thinking behind the stuff anyway.

Wouldn't it fit a bit better the other way around, though? RED is typically the "event" or "customs" server (in my eyes, at any rate).

I've never liked the "waffle shotguns" feature on either server, so I'd enjoy seeing it "off" on one or both. As for crits, I'd like the idea of having them off by default on one server so long as they could be re-enabled by vote (as unlikely as that might be).

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On a related note, I've always wondered why waffleshots are on.

I believe it was done to make shotguns behave more like shotguns. Previously, it was possible to do 20 damage at long range using a shot gun based on how the pellets lined up. This led to instances where a crit shotgun blast from long range would do +100 damage. I was able to play Scout and kill Snipers at range, which is unfair in a lot of ways. Then you would have instances where a perfect shotgun shot only did minimal damage because the pellets all spawned at the edge of the recticle. This was annoying to any class that relies on their shotgun.

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I believe it was done to make shotguns behave more like shotguns. Previously, it was possible to do 20 damage at long range using a shot gun based on how the pellets lined up. This led to instances where a crit shotgun blast from long range would do +100 damage. I was able to play Scout and kill Snipers at range, which is unfair in a lot of ways. Then you would have instances where a perfect shotgun shot only did minimal damage because the pellets all spawned at the edge of the recticle. This was annoying to any class that relies on their shotgun.

Ok, yeah, in that case, forget I said anything.

Edit: That FemSpy is AWESOME.

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I would like to see BLU with crits off by default. Playing well and lining up a kill, only to be thwarted by a random crit can be very frustrating. I would like to mention that I support no random spread for shotguns to remain off. The amount of damage variance can be staggering when it's randomized.

Also worth noting; even though I honestly have very little understanding of how the map vote works, would it be at all possible to make it so that it only pops up after a round ends? I've been killed by the vote popup weapon denial than I'd like to admit.

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Some of our crits aren't random... :twisted:

I'm well aware of that. I'm saying that suddenly doing 3x(?) damage at a critical time could very well turn the tide of the entire match. Such as a crit rocket taking out an entire front, or a Pyro getting near instant kills on an entire cart at once. These can be fine, but it's rather upsetting if it's based entirely on luck, and not anything on the player's (or allies') planning or ability.

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I'd be good if even one of the servers had random crits as well as damage spread turned off. If that's not an option what about reserved slot holders having the ability to bring up a crit vote without having to get a majority?

I would love nothing more than shutting random crits off (tf_weapon_criticals 0) on BLU. Disabling damage spread (tf_damage_disablespread 1) couldn't hurt either.

Of course, it wouldn't make sense to turn waffle shots back on if you've disabled those two.

Having said that, over a distance, unless you get lucky, turning waffles shots on lowers your over-distance damage rather than raising it.

We need 100% crits during pregame mayhem.

Likely won't happen. As far as I'm aware, the current plugin hasn't been updated for two and a half years, and even if it was, I don't think 100% crits is a simple cvar toggle like instant respawn and friendly fire are.

Some of our crits aren't random... :twisted:

Yes, and those crits (Kritzkrieg-created or any weapons that does crits/mini-crits) aren't affected by disabling random crits.

I haven't really seen anyone opposing a change to disable random crits on one of the servers. My preference would be to disable them on BLU, along with damage spread.

If no one opposes this change over the next few days, I'm tempted to just throw the switch to change it. I don't want this to do some long, drawn out process like the "should we reset stats" thing originally was.

The ONLY downside I've seen on no-crit servers is that the Spy's backstab animation no longer plays (even though players still die in one hit), which is extremely confusing if you're using Your Eternal Reward.

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No objection here. I don't mind random crits or damage spread, personally, but not having them wouldn't affect my enjoyment of the game. Probably.

Plus, it'll nerf Krug's uncanny ability to get (random, non-targe) crits with that blasted skullcutter. :nicework:

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These can be fine, but it's rather upsetting if it's based entirely on luck, and not anything on the player's (or allies') planning or ability.

I'll assume this is frustrated hyperbole since crits are not "based entirely on luck" and actually happen more frequently to players based on damage done in the past 20 seconds. The wiki has a nice article here http://tf2wiki.net/wiki/Critical_hits#Critical_hit_chance

Cheers!

-Krowbar

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Honestly, the only weapon where passive, random crits are occasionally an issue is the rocket launcher. Usually it's the soldier's 2nd rocket that is the crit because he deals damage to a clump of people on a cart / point with the first shot, raising his % chance on shots 2 and 3. This is a reward for doing well and shouldn't be taken away imo...but if everyone else feels otherwise I won't make a big fuss about it.

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This is an admin vote kinda thing.

I vote no to turning of crits. Don't like how the game was designed, go play CoD.

OK, one vote for not turning off crits, turning on ctf crits, and turning off waffleshots.

Or did you forget those were how the game was designed?

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