The Derrit Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 this is the best offtop thread in awhile except that its not in offtop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaon Posted January 2, 2010 Author Share Posted January 2, 2010 this is the best offtop thread in awhile except that its not in offtop Derrit. DERRIT. THREADS ABOUT MOVIES GO IN COMMUNITY DERRIT. THEY GO IN COMMUNITY. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Fox Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 I didn't care about the whole "gang rape" and "nightmare inducing scenes" you talked about, mainly because older versions of the story are actually worse, and one of pivotal functions of fairy tales is to deal with these kinds of taboos. What intrigues me is your definition of a dwarf, which is tremendously Lord of the Rings based, a book that not only doesn't predate the disney film, but also doesn't predate the tale of Snow White itself. Ok, you can argue that Tolkien dwarves are inpired in northern mythology, but northern dwarves aren't the only kind of dwarvish creature imagined in Europe. There are other kinds of dwarfs, and they are sad, sad, sad with all this ignorance. The dwarves are sad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHands Posted January 2, 2010 Share Posted January 2, 2010 Disney's littered with this kind of shit, but most of the early ones weren't specifically for children. They were made to appeal to a wider audience. That's why most of the villains are actually pretty badass. The other interesting aspect of this conversation is what everyone's preconceived notions of a Disney film are. Most of them have very, very dark stories that are told in relatively bright means. Consider The Great Mouse Detective. It's a battle of egos between two brilliant characters. One of said characters is known for drowning orphans and widows, aspires to commit regicide, and regularly murders his own henchmen whenever they disagree with him. This is all done in a sing-songy Major key. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ajax Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 This is all done in a sing-songy Major key. ... I think you can get away with anything as long as it's done this way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Damned Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 It's true. The first batch of SS troops in Germany were also accomplished singers and musicians. How else do you think they won so many battles in the early parts of the war? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doni Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Totally confirmed that he says "Good kitty" and you can see it's the guy's scrawny knee?The nude chick photo in The Rescuers is real, though. pump up the volume and listen again.... i know he says good kitty. You have something called a Disney block, which blocks out all the bad things Disney does. You probably don't even acknowledge that there are little slave children putting together your newest stitch plushie. nude chick in the rescuers is real? I saw that one too but I thought it was a fake because I didn't have the original VHS to waste hours of my youth scanning Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flare4War Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 And what about the part in the Lion King when Simba flops down in the grass and the dust and leaves whisk away in the wind spelling "SEX". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Derrit Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Derrit.DERRIT. THREADS ABOUT MOVIES GO IN COMMUNITY DERRIT. THEY GO IN COMMUNITY. i lol'ed carry on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thalzon Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 And what about the part in the Lion King when Simba flops down in the grass and the dust and leaves whisk away in the wind spelling "SEX". It may be something else entirely. Disney originally denied having another studio do any animation for the film and did not credit them, so SEK animation (over in Korea or someplace like it) added in that little bit of subtlety as a means of crediting themselves. Anyway it's obvious Lion King advocates a monarchy under god (the circle of life) and that the peasants should just go and die. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salluz Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Disney's littered with this kind of shit, but most of the early ones weren't specifically for children. They were made to appeal to a wider audience. That's why most of the villains are actually pretty badass.The other interesting aspect of this conversation is what everyone's preconceived notions of a Disney film are. Most of them have very, very dark stories that are told in relatively bright means. Consider The Great Mouse Detective. It's a battle of egos between two brilliant characters. One of said characters is known for drowning orphans and widows, aspires to commit regicide, and regularly murders his own henchmen whenever they disagree with him. This is all done in a sing-songy Major key. Yeah, and remember the furrygirl club scene when the woman was telling the guys to drink your beer because your baby's here? R-RATED!!! HAHAHAHAHA! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeoForte Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 And what about the part in the Lion King when Simba flops down in the grass and the dust and leaves whisk away in the wind spelling "SEX". It is suppose to say SFX. Just as it moved the F kinda turned into a E. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flare4War Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Anyway it's obvious Lion King advocates a monarchy under god (the circle of life) and that the peasants should just go and die. This made me burst into laughter. This and the liquor I'm drinking probably. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Derrit Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Also did anyone notice that in Mulan she's all like "i'm independent" and then in the sequel she's a submissive housewife that takes care of her husband? Disney promotes women staying in the goddamn kitchen. after finding a husband by any means necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nabeel Ansari Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Disney promotes women staying in the goddamn kitchen. after finding a husband by any means necessary. This is still in Disney movies today, like in Emperor's new groove. Pacha's wife? In the house, cooking and cleaning the entire movie. Even in the TV series of this movie she sits in her house and she actually homeschools Kuzco when he's sick of going to school. She makes him hate it, but this promotes the idea of women being housewives and better educators than men. :tomatoface: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaon Posted January 3, 2010 Author Share Posted January 3, 2010 Pacha's wife? In the house, cooking and cleaning the entire movie. Yeah, but to be fair, she was in the final stages of pregnancy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nabeel Ansari Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Yeah, but to be fair, she was in the final stages of pregnancy. Not in the TV series for that movie, she wasn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHands Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 Really, we're looking at this the wrong way. Walt Disney was only involved until he died, his last film was The Jungle Book. That means (to stay on topic) we should limit ourselves to: Snow White (discussed) Pinocchio (a story of a demonic puppet doing terrible things to get rewarded by turning into a human) Fantasia (the first animated film featuring Satan, who was later renamed Chernabog after a pagan god of night) Dumbo (a story about freak-hood which promotes depression), Bambi (pro-hunting) A few terrible racist South American films (not kidding, go check out The Three Caballeros) Cinderella (relying on help from others rather than strength of self to overcome relatively simple obstacles) Alice in Wonderland (pro-acid movie) Peter Pan (pro-abduction, potential child molestation, and piracy) Lady and the Tramp (never trust Asians) Sleeping Beauty (same as Cinderella, different context) One Hundred and One Dalmatians (fur makes ugly people more attractive, Jazz makes evil people more cool) Sword in the Stone (if you focus on weaponry and magic, you'll become king) Jungle Book (promotes racism, hypnotism, homelessness [baloo is basically a wandering hobo], and managed to alienate The Beatles [originally supposed to play the vultures. I shit you not.]) EDIT: Forgot the partially animated ones too. Reluctant Dragon (Racism) Victory through Air Power (Propaganda) Song of the South (Happy recently freed slaved staying behind to tell stories about racist Foxes and Bears) So Dear to my Heart (No fucking idea what the hell this is) Mary Poppins (Witchcraft, drug enabling, financial neglect, and potential gambling during the animated scene. Also hints of probable drug use in said scenes) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaon Posted January 3, 2010 Author Share Posted January 3, 2010 Sword in the Stone (if you focus on weaponry and magic, you'll become king) Shit yeah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meteo Xavier Posted January 3, 2010 Share Posted January 3, 2010 And I thought I took movies too srsly... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Strader Posted January 4, 2010 Share Posted January 4, 2010 I remember always thinking the girl dog in "Lady and the Tramp" was the tramp. I was a kid back then. But for some reason I knew what tramp meant. And that female dog was it. But then I pondered why they would name the boy dog "Lady". Eh, it's still a little confusing to this day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thylacine Posted January 4, 2010 Share Posted January 4, 2010 Yeah, yeah, Disney's in the liquid hydrogen chamber now and everything past "Bare Necessities" is not relevant. Want to talk about this point a few pages back for a sec; will try not to derail this fascinating topic too badly... Anyway, I may have seen it, but it's funny how the new Disney is overly left; Mulan, House of Mouse, etc. Full of homosexuality, just raging of gay lusts....What, the cross-dressing? Warner Brothers did that way back - just thought they were keeping up with the Bugs Bunny laughs. I assume you're talking about the male soldiers dressing as females and seducing the Hun guards? It seemed to be more about female equality (making the female role the "superior" after it was inferior the entire movie) than about homosexuality.I still haven't seen the travesty that is the sequel, but if this is Disney (company) apologizing for the years of the ideal woman being white/European and deliberately racist jokes, I think the whole Princess and Frog "Look, it's a black princess!" and the Lilo & Stitch "Sis has thighs!" has more to do with that than an alien consistently dressing as a woman. I can't argue the House of Mouse because I'm not sure what you're referring to. If it's the cartoon series I'm thinking of, then I say it's just Disney trying to be like Warner Brothers in its jokes. --- The issues mentioned in the list TheHands provided above can all be explained by one thing: these weren't films for kids. No, seriously, these were movies for adults that kids could come along to. The freaky acid trip stuff was a staple for films (watch some earlier films with dream sequences), and the other stuff was just par for the course in Hollywood. Compared to today's standards, yeah, Disney supporting Nazi party members has some believability to it. Back then (pre-Civil rights), though, everyone was making jokes about black people (or had them stuck in the kitchen, like good ol' wifey) and had implied rape / drugs / Satan as key plot points or metaphors. The only reason we're offended is because we've heard of Martin Luther King, Jr. and the only cartoons we see smoking nowadays are on Cowboy Bebop reruns. If anything, Disney kept it tame. Tame enough for kids to go and still enjoy the film, even though most of the deeper stuff would only make sense to adults (which Warner Bros. also did). Watching TCM is an educational experience... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archaon Posted January 4, 2010 Author Share Posted January 4, 2010 I think it's a bit of a stretch to say that Bambi is pro-hunting. In fact, I think it's a LOT of a stretch. That is stretching on the level of Goatse. There's hunting in the movie, yes, but considering the whole story is told from the perspective of the cute little talking animals, and humans are made out to be shadowy, inscrutable horrors, I wouldn't really call that an advocation. Audiences were not yelling "HELL YES HUNTING" when Bambi's mother got shot. Granted, I suppose you could argue that being portrayed as fear and death incarnate is pretty awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenPi Posted January 4, 2010 Share Posted January 4, 2010 Hell yes hunting!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maco70 Posted January 4, 2010 Share Posted January 4, 2010 There are several scholarly papers written about these topics. Interesting stuff, considering Disney has its fingers in so many different outlets. Whose interest is really kept in mind? oh, by the way... http://www.cjr.org/resources/index.php?c=disney Disney really does have its fingers in pretty much every outlet. Touchstone Pictures Hollywood Pictures Miramax Films ABC Network ESPN (80%) Hollywood Records US Weekly (50%) Just to name a few... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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