ectogemia Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Assuming a truly normal distribution of intelligence, half of all people are of below average intelligence; half of all people have an IQ below 100. That pretty much constitutes a majority, thus shit like "Yooz a stoopid hooo" gets stupid popular. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Burns Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Music has always been terrible. Music was terrible back when Mozart was alive. We remember the decent stuff and forget the much more abundant terrible stuff, so it always seems like the present is worse than the past. I agree with Moseph and WillRock. But it's still a bit different these days, especially since that Nicky Minaj youtube video has made (it appears) tens of thousands of dollars in just 2 days, and I assume will eventually make hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions of dollars. Music can play to different aspects of life -- some music, Stupid Hoe perhaps, is loaded with a lot of really specific social meanings and signals, and not just in the lyrics. The Nicky Minaj character, the ways she inflects her voice, the genealogy of the production, the repetition, the video . . . it all works together to create meaning -- even if you still think it's crap. But, of course, if we wanted to look at that piece through the lens of purely "musical" characteristics (it's up to you to define that), then yeah -- definitely crap. This battle between innate musical characteristics and social meaning has been around for a long time in music criticism, (ethno)musicology, etc. Old fogies like Schoenberg and Theodore Adorno argue that music should be criticised (and ideally consumed/experienced) based on the innate musical characteristics present in the piece: form, motivic manipulation, etc. More recently, (ethno)musicology has emphasized more the social meaning of works. But regardless of how academia has evolved, I think it's obvious that, for whatever reasons (technology, etc), social meaning can take music a lot further these days than it used to, and the industry has grown around that. Hence, it's easy to say a lot of music sucks these days -- especially when you're not the targeted audience of meaning. Also -- with the youtube setup -- anything freakish is potentially valuable, so there's that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salluz Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Nicki Minaj, how could you be such a misrepresentation of Stupid Hoes likes that? They're often really good people! The progressions are recycled for fast, repetitive songwriting (popmachine). They're mostly 1-5-4-1, 1-4-5-1, 1-5-4-5, 1-4-5-4, 1-4-1-5, 1-5-1-4. The overuse of 'perfect' chords makes the music listenable, but predictable and boring. The melodies, style and methods for making songs are similar. Dumb music creates a dumb audience, based on what Hitler once said: if you want to take over a nation, start with its music A lot of music is suited just for the club/bar/whatever. Money is the main goal of the execs/producers/distributors. They found a way to do it and still get paid, b/c you and I won't buy that crap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chernabogue Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Stop complaining about the mainstream and go find music you enjoy listening to. This. I only buy/download albums I want to listen to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omnipotentBagel Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I would agree with those who say that there's always been plenty of crap out there and that the ravages of time work well to help filter the good from the bad, but I'd like to add that radio certainly has deteriorated. Sure, there've always been the crap stations, but there was a time when some radio stations would play entire albums, so that masterpieces like "Days of Future Passed" and "Dark Side of the Moon" could be experienced as they were meant to be experienced. My local Classic Rock station would still do this late night when I was in high school, although I'm pretty sure they don't anymore. These days, it seems like all you really get on the radio anymore is Top 40 hits and "classic" stations that play the annoying pop music of the last 3 decades or so, and focused stations that really care about the quality of music they play have really died out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psychowolf Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Radio has always had terrible music due to mostly sticking to the charts, I haven't listened to the radio in years and when i do i stick to the local london "love song" station known as "heart" that station sticks to stuff from the 80's to early 90's and mainstream stuff we actually remember. Find your own music, stop worrying about whats coming out atm, if its enjoyable you'l hear it years from now, and if it sucks youl never hear it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salluz Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 WillRock is right though, go freaking find music you like But at the same time, it is amazing how low people have gone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerrax Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Honestly I love more music from the past decade than any other time. Just not much mainstream stuff. A lot of progressive and power metal bands of recent years are doing some awesome stuff, while mainstream metal has been choking on the same stale crap since the 90's. Never been a fan of mainstream hip-hop, but damn there is some sweet shit below the radar. Rock 'n roll as we know it has been completely fragmented and is unrecognizable, but that hasn't stopped some pretty cool bands from emerging. Music as we have experienced it in the past has changed, but the good stuff is still out there, always has been, always will be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTAHater836 Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 The way I see it, the decades 195X, 196X, and 197X, as well as 1980-1984, were the best. Pardon my cliche cynicism, but about 90% of songs better than what O-Clocked has to offer was made in that 3 1/2 decade interval. The decades 198X and 199X had a fair amount of merit to them, but I can't decide whether they're as good as O-Clocked. However, since Y2K, there have been some good tracks in commercial music, but not a lot. The number 13 turned out unlucky for Weird Al Yankovic (aka the Prince of Parodies): As he was trying to make his 13th album, ALpocalypse, even he admitted he was having trouble looking for good source material to make parodies of. Worse, the pro critics said that the album had a lot of lackluster tracks (IMO, those included "Skipper Dan", "Craigslist", "Another Tattoo", and "If That Isn't Love"), but said it wasn't Weird Al's fault because there wasn't enough good source material to go around. It's easy to see why. Since 2008, the similarities between one song and another are more obvious than ever before, there's less memorability or reason to remember these songs, and too many of them have voices that sound like Akon or Beyonce, as a consequence of Autotune. In an interview about the production of Episode 1305, Fishsticks, Trey Parker and Matt Stone admitted they determined that singing talent varies inversely with how "good" (term used loosely) the Autotune devices sound (with 20th century music machinery, talent and output quality varied directly, not inversely). Even worse music has to be tailor-made for young girls, including Hannah Montana, The Jonas Brothers, High School Musical, and Justin Bieber, all of which make The Spice Girls sound tame. In Episode 1301, The Ring, a Mickey Mouse like entity admitted that The Jonas Brothers' music sucks, and that Disney's promotion of it is the entire reason the band was a hit back in 2008 and 2009. And don't forget Episode 1507, You're Getting Old; Tween wave is apparently a real genre, and if it sounds as that episode depicts (without the sounds of defecation obviously), then at least tween wave doesn't come on the radio that often, or else I'd lose all faith in the recording industry. But I must admit, in the past 5 years, there has been some good music (not necessarily "independent" music), but it's not what the industry or much of anyone promotes: They're easier to find on the internet rather than driving around town trying to find it, but also harder to find because some of us only hear the names of the good bands and tracks once or twice ever, so unless we document it somewhere, we'd have to sift through the sh(beep) to find anything worth listening to. All I can do is hope that by the decade 202X, discerning listeners can help us forget all the low-quality mainstream music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orlouge82 Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Even worse music has to be tailor-made for young girls, including Hannah Montana, The Jonas Brothers, High School Musical, and Justin Bieber... To me, a big part of the decline in music is because media conglomerates are producing "music" to specifically cater to a narrow demographic to increase sales in other areas (clothes, DVDs, random plastic crap, etc). That, and I guess things like American Idol (or Pop Idol to you Brits) have made music about making money (i.e. through advertising) rather than letting bands and artists make music as an actual form of expression. Thus, the homogeneity of today's music. If corporations backed off and actually let musicians do their thing, the quality of music would definitely increase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelCityOutlaw Posted January 22, 2012 Author Share Posted January 22, 2012 I'm not sure I understand this thread. What are people complaining about. Music has always had shit music thats been more popular than stuff thats awesome, but time has a way of making people forget these songs (for the most part). You can find good music from any year in music if you look hard enough, sure its not always mainstream but when was mainstream ever seen as "good music" with the exception of the beatles As for people bashing the radio, same concept. So many great radio stations out there, you've just gotta find them. Imo, stop complaining about the mainstream and go find music you enjoy listening to. Mainstream can't exactly be ignored, but you don't have to bask in its mediocrity wondering what the hell happened to "good music". Good music is out there and these days, its easier to find than ever thanks to the wonders of the internet (back in the day, you just had what was on Top of the Pops and music you brought on the strength of its cover art) Just look for good music, and you'll find it. As stated in the first post, yeah there's always been lame songs that are popular. It goes without saying that people will just find music they like and be done with it. 90% of what I listen to never makes it on the radio. But the thread is about discussing the current mainstream standard, which seems to be of considerably lower quality than years past. The point was to see what others reasoning are for this beyond, "it's just your opinion". The other point was to see where you think pop music is headed. Like this, To me, a big part of the decline in music is because media conglomerates are producing "music" to specifically cater to a narrow demographic to increase sales in other areas (clothes, DVDs, random plastic crap, etc).That, and I guess things like American Idol (or Pop Idol to you Brits) have made music about making money (i.e. through advertising) rather than letting bands and artists make music as an actual form of expression. Thus, the homogeneity of today's music. If corporations backed off and actually let musicians do their thing, the quality of music would definitely increase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenon Odyssey Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I agree with Moseph and WillRock. But it's still a bit different these days, especially since that Nicky Minaj youtube video has made (it appears) tens of thousands of dollars in just 2 days, and I assume will eventually make hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions of dollars.Music can play to different aspects of life -- some music, Stupid Hoe perhaps, is loaded with a lot of really specific social meanings and signals, and not just in the lyrics. The Nicky Minaj character, the ways she inflects her voice, the genealogy of the production, the repetition, the video . . . it all works together to create meaning -- even if you still think it's crap. But, of course, if we wanted to look at that piece through the lens of purely "musical" characteristics (it's up to you to define that), then yeah -- definitely crap. This battle between innate musical characteristics and social meaning has been around for a long time in music criticism, (ethno)musicology, etc. Old fogies like Schoenberg and Theodore Adorno argue that music should be criticised (and ideally consumed/experienced) based on the innate musical characteristics present in the piece: form, motivic manipulation, etc. More recently, (ethno)musicology has emphasized more the social meaning of works. But regardless of how academia has evolved, I think it's obvious that, for whatever reasons (technology, etc), social meaning can take music a lot further these days than it used to, and the industry has grown around that. Hence, it's easy to say a lot of music sucks these days -- especially when you're not the targeted audience of meaning. Also -- with the youtube setup -- anything freakish is potentially valuable, so there's that. Since we don't have a feature on these forums, I like/endorse this post. Really the only thing radio and mainstream music has going for it these days are the massive budgets and social trends that they either cater or inflict upon the masses. That shit cray. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Briggs Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I'm laughing at this thread because it's titled "what the hell happened to music!?" and the OP example is by one of my girlfriend's favorite artists of all time. she and I watched this video the night it came out because she got a text from Nicki Minaj's Twitter. I don't like the song very much at all, but I can also tell that people like nicki minaj (and lady gaga) are strictly half-assing it. it's part of being a pop star now. kind of like "welp, everything's been done before... let's obviously stop trying altogether to freshen things up!" it's all about being "ironic" now really though, if you're looking for traditional musicality in rap songs I don't know what to tell you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelCityOutlaw Posted January 22, 2012 Author Share Posted January 22, 2012 Also yes, Patrick Burns' post was epic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Briggs Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 the best antidote to modern pop is phil collins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meteo Xavier Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 If absolutely every hates everything on the radio or in mainstream music as they claim to (because its pretty much the first requirement these days for anyone who enjoys music more than a casual level), how do they know what all is playing on the radio to hate? Or why are they listening to it at all? On my list of things I really mean to study on a scientific level someday is to find out these cultural HATRED of "Mainstream" music and stuff that's "played on the radio." Because it can't just be an issue of quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frederic Petitpas Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I hate LMFAO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Briggs Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I hate LMFAO your loss! *shuffles* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Strader Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 your loss!*shuffles* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mak Eightman Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I'm not going to complain here: 90's - 2008 - I like it) And once in a week I'm listening Mozart's Requiem:p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omnipotentBagel Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 If absolutely every hates everything on the radio or in mainstream music as they claim to (because its pretty much the first requirement these days for anyone who enjoys music more than a casual level), how do they know what all is playing on the radio to hate? Or why are they listening to it at all?On my list of things I really mean to study on a scientific level someday is to find out these cultural HATRED of "Mainstream" music and stuff that's "played on the radio." Because it can't just be an issue of quality. It's a problem of exposure. The Top 40 hits or what-have-you are the kind of radio being played for ambiance at a majority of public places, so even if you never listen to radio personally, you're probably going to get plenty of exposure to it. And for some people who don't like it, being repeatedly subjected to it just makes it worse, so you get people who feel the need to rant about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirby Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 It doesn't help that some stations seem to only have like 20 songs on their playlist, so you hear the same crap over and over and over again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OceansAndrew Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 your loss!*shuffles* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonAvenger Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I hate LMFAO Your loss *wiggle wiggle wiggle wiggle wiggle* YEAH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tensei Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 what the hell happened to music!? Absolutely fucking nothing happened to music. People say this kind of stuff every generation, and it's always equally false (or true). The 90s had plenty of dumb eurodance/house/boyband crap that was universally loathed by people who grew up in the 70s-80s, just like how nowadays the 90s generation loves to hate on mainstream dubstep and hiphop. The reason that the 90s SEEM better to you is because you're remembering it with a healthy dose of childhood nostalgia, and you probably don't even remember most of the really bad/mediocre stuff they played anyway, just because it was so forgettable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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