timaeus222   Members

Hey, no worries. I'm pretty new to the orchestral scene too. I can infuse orchestral instruments into my electronic music, but writing an entire orchestral piece is pretty tough. Mainly because of the many parts you have to write at once every step of the way; if only sampler engines could intelligently detect how many voices you have and distribute them to the right instruments based on pitch, right?

Something I've been working on recently for some reason that won't be revealed yet. http://soundcloud.com/timaeus222/dark-barren-world-wip

The rhythm gets bit lost in the beginning. It took me a few rewinds to figure out the time signature was 6/8 with a 5/8 at the fourth iteration. I don't want to have to tap my finger and count the beat like that just to get a groove going. Intro has just high and low brass and cinematic percussion (djembes?). Low end is muddy for the tubas and french horns, and I can't hear the individual notes. If your samples aren't doing it for you, write simpler notes for those low brass instruments. 1:08-1:56 gets really cluttered. French horn notes are bleeding into each other, and I can't distinguish the trumpet notes from the trombone notes (are you even using trumpets? Yeah, I actually had to ask). Basically, too many moving parts at the same time. It's like babysitting 3 or 4 hyper kids all with differing personalities. 1:56 sounds separate from what came before, so you'll be needing a transition there. 2:27 sounds a bit blocky to me. The straight eighth notes in the trombones and trumpets (and french horn?) disrupt the pacing a bit. 2:53-3:39 has the same problem as 1:08. Sounds to me like you're trying to use brass for everything, when you can totally use strings for some parts if you have them. This could be the inspiration you need. http://soundcloud.com/stephen-anderson/dinosaur-dna

I've decided to update my original picks too. Original post was updated as well. New picks:

Happy birthday! =D

Cosmic Sounds and I are pretty available.

Sounds like an awesome improvement from before, and now it's basically just samples that are your problem. Unfortunately that's pretty much only solvable by spending money on a sample library. Rarely are dedicated orchestral songs believable with free samples or soundfonts. This arrangement on its own would pass, but yeah, you'll need better samples to do this dedicated an orchestral remix.

Kick at 0:31 is quiet. I can kinda hear a literal click, but it's nowhere near the ideal strength. 0:52 organ definitely doesn't fit, and I haven't a clue what it's doing there. I think 1:03-1:14 sounds pretty dissonant in the wrong way. You can hear it pretty clearly because of the polyphonic saw wave you used. Speaking of which, I think that's a really plain saw wave. Needs a little more personality to its tone. Maybe some detuning and heavy vibrato. 1:22 has weird low bass notes that seem to make it muddy, and makes it worse on the rhodes at 1:26. 1:51 key change is abrupt. 1:59 pitch dropping gated effect is pretty cool. 2:28 needs more to lead into that ambient ending. Interesting concept, needs those updates.

The instruments were pretty basic, especially the percussion. The SMB1 overworld also had a wrong note. You tried to put it into a minor key for part of it, but it doesn't work. You stuck to the first OW for too long, IMO. Sounds like you did a MIDI remix and tacked on the other two in the same way. 1:08 is really jarring and there's nothing to connect the two themes. 1:56 tempo change to the new theme is really obvious. You had a good idea with trying to connect these themes together as they should be related a little, but it wasn't quite as seamless as it should be for it to be a medley with interest. Maybe it'd be better if you tried one song at a time first, and then later on when you get really familiar with these themes and transitions, you can try again.

That sounds so wrong. xD EDIT: Okay, I've made my picks. 1. Junk Man (MM7) 2. (MM9)3. Cloud Man (MM7) 4. (MM9) 5. (MM6)

I wasn't really saying that your instruments were actually from the MIDI library---they just had that type of quality. Because of the plainness of the instruments (for example, the default square lead), any song can be put together using these instruments without very much actual mixing at all since their frequency distribution is thin already. That's a sign that you need higher quality instruments if you want to do more serious compositions.

Well, simply put, the instruments are more or less generic MIDI-instrument-library-based. Basically, the sounds used are dry and plain, and very little mixing is required for this kind of song. 1:18-1:23 was pretty good sequencing though on that square lead.

The first few seconds did not contribute to the song, IMO. It felt off-tempo. Guitar sounds mechanical and definitely fake. Too many hammer-ons and portamentos. Bass guitar is too loud near the 60Hz range. Sounds like it was just instruments replacing prewritten MIDI.

My belief is that if the end result sounds good, then the song is good. Even if your instrument reads as out of phase, the overall phase cancellation result would be pretty complex, so if it still sounds right overall, don't worry about it. I've never actually had any noticeable issues when I do wide panning. It's actually helped tremendously with my sound clarity and distinctness. (Just in case you're a little skeptical, you can try looking at my soundcloud if you want to)

Hm, you shouldn't have to simply low pass the lead like that. Isn't there a resonance knob in your synth? If you just low pass it, you take out the higher frequencies that help it to pierce through. If it's resonant, then it's boosted too much in one particular frequency range, but it moves with the current note being played (i.e. it's a keytracked/keyfollowed, internal EQ issue), so to lessen it, you'll have to turn down a resonance knob in your synth that should exist (it's a relatively common knob). I mean an actual, typical cymbal. I didn't really hear anything resembling a cymbal connecting those sections. Weird, it sounds a little bit different at 2:30. Did you add something else that also has delay, or change the snare velocities or sequencing? I don't know what DAW you're using (it's not in your profile at the moment), but do you happen to have an EQ that lets you see the frequencies that your instruments are occupying? Something like this (ignore the oval)? Wait a minute, are you sure you said that right? You said "the sub bass is side chained to the kick and snare." It should be the other way around, as the kick should be heard over the bass. It's also not entirely necessary to sidechain the snare to the bass. You could just do a peaking EQ at the snare fundamental (200~300Hz or so) and a notch EQ in the bass where the snare fundamental is. That should make some room; you could also try that with the kick. Another solution or additional thing you can do is pan the effects you have a little wider using ping pong delay that has particular delay times. If you make it so you can't hear the distinct echoes by speeding up the delay times to a certain extent, then it'll sound wider without sounding like actual delay. That should help with, for example, your wub-like bass at 3:13.

Have someone massage your hands if they start to hurt. Could be carpal tunnel. Hope not.

0:41 sine-like wave is too resonant. 0:55 - where's the cymbal? Dunno why, but the snare sounds wide to me. Should be panned center. Check the mix's low end some more. Still a little iffy. 2:30 snare delay is too much. Try using 2:18's snare delay feedback level at 2:30 and removing it at 2:18. 2:44 lead is same as before, and washed in reverb. Makes low end muddy. It's most obvious at 3:14 that it's cluttered spatially and frequency-wise. Snare overall is a little dry.

If you really need to, just PM them, assuming you haven't yet.

3:00 or so was the one part that stood out to me as cluttered, but aside from that, pretty well done!

Yep, arrangement is too close to the original. You even have the same little gliss in the beginning.

Chroma Car Keys was pretty cool. Guitar could have been less mechanical, but it's not a huge deal. Filler effects could have been a great addition, like white noise sweeps, etc. Speeding Ticket was missing some bass, and mostly the low end was a problem. I couldn't really get much low end power from it, from either the bass or the kick. Treble was an issue too, but less so. SDG II sounded pretty standard, although using the right articulations would also help with the realism; try imagining a real guitar player and that should help. i.e. use Tapping Mode if you actually want genuine finger tapping, use legato for fast passages, etc. H2Oil was a nice step up from the other three, but I think the intro pads were a little too quiet and simple, and needed a more evolving tone. Try looking at for an idea of what I mean for the pads. 0:34 synth lead was slightly too quiet in volume (not velocity) and thin. At 0:54 in particular, EP could have used louder tines, or just a quiet bell layered on top. It isn't needed in other parts where it's less exposed. 2:29 guitar could benefit from some chorus. 3:02 sine wave would be nicer with some slightly heavy vibrato. Would have been great if there was something to connect 3:55 and 3:57 together, and some richer pads at 3:57. These sound great overall, and just need some polish.

I don't know what samples you're using, but realism is a big problem here. You're trying to sound realistic, so humanization and good samples are a great idea. Maybe effective sequencing can let you get by sometimes, but other times you just need to use those special articulations well. 0:18 strings are not fake-sounding in terms of the samples used per se, but the articulations make it sound like the strings are falling behind. You need to give it a phrasing that makes sense, like someone is actually playing. 0:49 flute does sound like it's falling behind. Definitely because of the attack of the articulation(s) used. 1:16 is really suffering from weak samples. A stronger low string section would really improve the intensity level quite a bit. The reverb low cut is also killing the power. 1:40 isn't as powerful a break as you could have done had the cellos/double basses been a bit closer to the mic. 2:00 is oddly pretty good. Of course, it does have room for improvement, but here it's mainly the reverb that's the problem. Same with 2:31. I highly recommend this badass for your cinematic inspiration.

Well, the arrangement gets pretty spastic and goes plenty of places too quickly, but glad you had fun.

HEY. HEY. HEY. I could've sworn I said something, like, a year ago, but I didn't. D: By far the most variations I've ever heard on any one section in a source material. It took a few listens before I could really appreciate the amount of work it took to reiterate the same notes in completely different instrumentation and atmosphere, but this is masterful stuff. <3